Poll

Is it?

Yes
3 (20%)
No
4 (26.7%)
Maybe
8 (53.3%)

Total Members Voted: 15

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Author Topic: Is killing a murderer wrong?  (Read 11123 times)

Hello:)

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« on: December 23, 2012, 06:19:05 PM »
Discuss.
Good sir

« Reply #1 on: December 23, 2012, 08:09:37 PM »
Depends on the moral framework you're employing.

According to Christianity, "You shall not kill" is a moral imperative, although God himself frequently breaks his own rule in the Old Testament. Trying to figure that out is a barrel full of fun in itself.

Utilitarianism says it's okay if the alternative produces less desirable results. Most utilitarians prefer life in prison over execution, I think.

Rawlsian deontologists believe an act is wrong if it breaks a rule that rational individuals agree upon behind a veil of ignorance. Given that it's extremely difficult to prove guilt beyond a shadow of a doubt, they wouldn't desire the death penalty for heinous crimes (although they'd also seek to lock up convicted murderers).

Nihilists don't believe anything is right or wrong. Kick the ******* and hug his puppy.
Luigison: Question everything!
Me: Why?

CrossEyed7

  • i can make this whatever i want; you're not my dad
« Reply #2 on: December 23, 2012, 08:10:10 PM »
Let's say you kill someone you are sufficiently convinced is a murderer. If I'm convinced they were innocent, would I be justified in killing you (...justified in whose eyes?)?
"Oh man, I wish being a part of a Mario fan community was the most embarrassing thing about my life." - Super-Jesse

« Reply #3 on: December 23, 2012, 08:16:14 PM »
Also, this is relevant. Language warning:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OAUv2OTVm9M
Luigison: Question everything!
Me: Why?

Hello:)

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« Reply #4 on: December 23, 2012, 08:34:27 PM »
Let's say you kill someone you are sufficiently convinced is a murderer. If I'm convinced they were innocent, would I be justified in killing you (...justified in whose eyes?)?
Depends if there's absolute proof of the man being a murderer, if so, no. However, I mean with absolute proof.
Good sir

Markio

  • Normal
« Reply #5 on: December 23, 2012, 09:07:40 PM »
Yes, I think it is wrong to kill someone who has committed murder.  Displaced from the actual murder situation, it seems arbitrary to be allowed to kill someone who has once committed murder.  Life if you meet an ex-convict who had killed someone long ago and served their time and repented for their past deeds, and you just kill them??? Especially since murdering that person makes you a murderer.

If you're being pursued by an attacker who just murdered someone a moment ago, then it seems not only justified but also advisable to defend yourself by any means necessary, even if that results in the attacker's death.
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Hello:)

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« Reply #6 on: December 23, 2012, 09:10:37 PM »
I guess, but I mean one who didn't go to jail for it.
Good sir

CrossEyed7

  • i can make this whatever i want; you're not my dad
« Reply #7 on: December 23, 2012, 11:13:27 PM »
Depends if there's absolute proof of the man being a murderer, if so, no. However, I mean with absolute proof.
Absolute proof in whose eyes?

If you're going to go with life-for-a-life, you have to either say that everyone can just use their own judgment (which means everyone can kill whoever they want), or you say "No, here's an authority who will decide who should be killed and who shouldn't, rather than just relying on our individual judgment" which is just government-enforced capital punishment (which I'm also opposed to, incidentally).

You're not Batman. And if the universe has a protagonist, it's certainly not any of us.
"Oh man, I wish being a part of a Mario fan community was the most embarrassing thing about my life." - Super-Jesse

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« Reply #8 on: December 24, 2012, 06:54:08 AM »
Actually I didn't mean me, I meant anyone. Except marioguy/sadib.
Good sir

BP

  • Beside Pacific
« Reply #9 on: December 24, 2012, 01:44:27 PM »
I dunno. I only believe in one entity higher than each of us, and that's us, and I suppose breaking your social contract is grounds for having you removed from the rest of society. So, maybe. Regardless, it's more expensive to have the death penalty than it is to have life sentences in prison. Combine that with moral uncertainty and you get my lack of support for capital punishment.
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The Chef

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« Reply #10 on: December 24, 2012, 02:15:17 PM »
I'm surprised this guy knows who Sadib is.

Hello:)

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« Reply #11 on: December 24, 2012, 05:12:15 PM »
Dude, I study FF history.
Good sir

CrossEyed7

  • i can make this whatever i want; you're not my dad
« Reply #12 on: December 24, 2012, 06:09:37 PM »
The American criminal justice system is way too focused on retribution, with no real efforts toward rehabilitation (a public sentiment that happens to mesh very well together with the privatized prison industry's profit motives). Once you've gotten a murderer off the streets, the public is safe -- killing him or her at that point serves no purpose other than letting us feel like we've "gotten back" at them, or making a governor or other politician look "tough on crime", which are all very immature reasons for wanting to end a human life. Add in inconsistent standards of evidence, biased juries and judges, states that execute people with an IQ of 70, and the lopsided race and gender gaps in death sentencing (for equal crimes, the death sentence is much more likely to be given to non-whites than to whites, and men than women) and it's just a really bad idea.
"Oh man, I wish being a part of a Mario fan community was the most embarrassing thing about my life." - Super-Jesse

Hello:)

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« Reply #13 on: December 24, 2012, 06:23:51 PM »
I think Sadib would have a field day with this. Anyway, when did this turn into an argument about the justice system, and why? Crosseyed please be quiet.
Seriously though, CrossEyed, what if a murderer escaped? A death sentence makes sure that doesn't happen.
« Last Edit: December 24, 2012, 06:27:19 PM by Hello:) »
Good sir

The Chef

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« Reply #14 on: December 24, 2012, 06:29:28 PM »
Dude, I study FF history.

I didn't know they were teaching that in schools today.

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