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Video Games => Video Game Chat => Topic started by: BP on April 29, 2011, 04:05:08 PM

Title: All right now who do ya want in Smash Bros. 4
Post by: BP on April 29, 2011, 04:05:08 PM
You knew it was comin'. Keep the ridiculous ideas you know won't work or know really won't happen to a minimum, would you kindly (for example, I'm not gonna list any EarthBound characters)

Nintendah characters who are due their glory
-Little Mac
-Isaac
-Starfy

And I'm betting Red and Lucario will be gone, so
-Black or White, with Snivy, Dewott and Emboar
-Mienshao, maybe?

Third party characters, if Snake and that blue vermin are gonna be back--though with the Japanese title of Brawl, "X," standing for "Crossover," I slightly doubt it
-Mega Man
-Crono
Title: Re: All right now who do ya want in Smash Bros. 4
Post by: Turtlekid1 on April 29, 2011, 04:06:22 PM
-Anthony Higgs
Title: Re: All right now who do ya want in Smash Bros. 4
Post by: WarpRattler on April 29, 2011, 04:19:44 PM
Quote from: BP
Aaaaaaaall riiiiiiiight noooooooow
AGENT J HERE

Also, Mike Jones.
Title: Re: All right now who do ya want in Smash Bros. 4
Post by: CrossEyed7 on April 29, 2011, 04:26:50 PM
(https://themushroomkingdom.net/board/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fdefaultprime.com%2Fwp-content%2Fuploads%2F2010%2F01%2Fryuta_kawashima_brain_age.jpg&hash=6ade860c57532a94877c187796ac28ec)

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Title: Re: All right now who do ya want in Smash Bros. 4
Post by: Weegee on April 29, 2011, 04:46:02 PM
HALO
Title: Re: All right now who do ya want in Smash Bros. 4
Post by: bobman37 on April 29, 2011, 04:50:02 PM
Banjo-Kazooie and Elite Beat Agents would indeed be totally rad.
Title: Re: All right now who do ya want in Smash Bros. 4
Post by: PaperLuigi on April 29, 2011, 05:04:44 PM
Mewtwo
Title: Re: All right now who do ya want in Smash Bros. 4
Post by: Black Mage on April 29, 2011, 05:20:07 PM
Get rid of ROB and put in Mega Man.

Like it should've been the first time.
Title: Re: All right now who do ya want in Smash Bros. 4
Post by: PaperLuigi on April 29, 2011, 05:47:59 PM
I don't understand Nintendo's fascination with ROB. I really don't.
Title: Re: All right now who do ya want in Smash Bros. 4
Post by: A on April 29, 2011, 05:59:58 PM
Sagi and Kalas.

(https://themushroomkingdom.net/board/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fimages.wikia.com%2Fbatenkaitos%2Fimages%2Fe%2Fe3%2FSagi.jpg&hash=dafd9ea4b7c996bb6ef20b8f6d043718)
(https://themushroomkingdom.net/board/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fimages.wikia.com%2Fbatenkaitos%2Fimages%2F5%2F59%2FKalas.jpg&hash=242e39e5625f0ee2368a311d6325ac25)

Because Smash doesn't have enough guys with blue hair.
Title: Re: All right now who do ya want in Smash Bros. 4
Post by: Lizard Dude on April 29, 2011, 06:37:27 PM
Was this actually announced? I haven't heard about it anywhere...
Title: Re: All right now who do ya want in Smash Bros. 4
Post by: Ultima Shadow on April 29, 2011, 06:58:30 PM
Not a character request per se, but costumes.

Not just colour changes and such, but proper ones, sort of like WWWario -> Classic Wario. Still the same combat stats, only with a couple of effect changes and sound changes. For example;

Dr. Mario (similar to the effects he had in Melee)
Classic Wario (change some of the effects to ones more befitting of the older Wario)
Young Link (pretty much the same as Toon Link)
Roy (Marth but with fire effects)
Mewtwo (if Lucario is still in the game, change his effects to more psychic-y ones. Otherwise, put him in for whatever Lucario is replaced with)
Donkey Kong Jr (for Donkey Kong?)
Assortment of different retro characters (for Mr G&W. Would like to see Stanley the Bugman make his triumphant return...)
Title: Re: All right now who do ya want in Smash Bros. 4
Post by: Weegee on April 29, 2011, 07:59:28 PM
Was this actually announced? I haven't heard about it anywhere...

I think BP just made this topic for the heck of it. Google doesn't produce any official results for SSB4.
Title: Re: All right now who do ya want in Smash Bros. 4
Post by: The Chef on April 30, 2011, 09:09:27 AM
Mario Series
Mario
Luigi
Peach
Bowser
Yoshi
Wario

No new Mario characters please. Everything is adequately represented. Toad would be good but he's already part of Peach's moveset and as plenty of people have pointed he's been demoted to a drone character (much to my chagrin). Bowser Jr. shouldn't be in because he hasn't been around as long as these other characters nor has he appeared in as many games. As much as I like Dr. Mario, he probably shouldn't come back because people will still whine about it (and you gotta admit, having two Marios is pretty dumb). No other Mario character deserves a spot as much as the seven above. That's it. Case closed.

Donkey Kong Series
Donkey Kong
Diddy Kong
Dixie Kong

Dixie is most likely as she was planned for Brawl. A lot of people seem to think King K.Rool is viable, but I think it should be Kaptain K.Rool in the playable spot, 'cause he has a kickin' blunderbuss! Personally though, I'd rather have him be a boss character.

Zelda Series
New version of Link
New version of Zelda
New version of Ganondorf
Either Toon Link or another new version of a younger Link

Face it, by the time the next Smash is out we'll have at least one new Link, Zelda and Ganondorf to worry about. If the "toon" sub-series is still going Toon Link will probably still be in but if not, it's hard to tell who else they'll add. Maaaybe Tingle, but his role as an Assist Trophy makes enough sense.

Metroid Series
Samus / Zero Suit Samus

I've seen a lot of people suggest the other Hunters from Metroid Prime Hunters or even Ridley, but I honestly feel that being a boss character did Ridley the most amount of justice. When you're a boss, you're much bigger than any normal character and you can pull of moves that a normal playable character cannot.

Kirby Series
Kirby
Meta Knight
King Dedede

This is basically it for Kirby. I mean, unless they start adding the Helpers and stuff to pad the roster but I doubt that'll happen.

Star Fox
Fox
Falco
Wolf

A lot of people suggest Krystal but after the fiasco that was Star Fox Command I don't think people would be too happy about it (unless you're a furry of some sort). There aren't really many other character they could add, and I don't think this series needs more than three. It was bad enough they added Wolf AND made him another semi-clone of Fox.

Pokemon Series
Pikachu
Pokemon Trainer
Jigglypuff
Mewtwo / Lucario / New important Pokemon

Pikachu is the mascot, Red is a unique enough character to stay, and Jigglypuff should be kept for the sake of Smash tradition. Ideally I'd prefer Mewtwo to come back, but if they repeat what they did with Lucario it's very likely they'll just replace him with whatever Pokemon is popular or important at the time of the next Smash's release.

F-ZERO Series
Captain Falcon
Samurai Goroh

Knowing Sakurai we'd probably be just left with PAAAAAUNCH from here to eternity, but you all know it was a criminal offense to not include Goroh in Brawl.

MOTHER Series
Ness
Lucas

Now I know both Earthbound and MOTHER 3 have a lot of other unique characters to work with, but the problem is deciding on which ones. Everyone seems to think the Masked Man should be in but I think that would kinda ruin the the integrity of the friggin' story behind MOTHER 3. Others want Pokey, but like Ridley I think it's a better choice to have him be a boss. The only other character I can see them adding is Ninten, if only to round out the trinity of MOTHER protagonists, but unless they change up his moveset people are probably gonna cry foul for having yet ANOTHER character that's similar to both Ness and Lucas.

Fire Emblem Series
Marth
New Lord

Marth deserves to be in no matter what since he's the protagonist of the first FE game and also managed to star in two more remakes of it. Now, we all know Roy was a clone of Marth and Ike was a replacement for Roy. Both Roy and Ike were the most recent FE protagonists at the time of Melee and Brawl's releases, respectively. Therefore, it's probably safe to say that Ike will once again be replaced by the star of whatever FE game is most recent by the time the next Smash is out.

Ice Climber Series
    Ice Climbers

Game & Watch Series
    Mr. Game & Watch

Just wanted to point out that I think Mr. Game & Watch would look funny if he had eyes and teeth like the other little guys on Flat Zone.

Kid Icarus Series
    Pit

Here I will point out that I wish Pit looked more like his NES/GB artwork than his Uprising design.

Pikmin Series
    Olimar

Robot Series
    R.O.B.

I thought it would be cool if Prof. Hector appeared riding around on R.O.B., Yatterman-style but that could be difficult to program, not to mention an ultimately pointless addition in the long run.

Punch-Out!! Series [NEW]
    Little Mac

I'm with BP on this one. After being an Assist Trophy in Brawl and having a full on comeback in the new Punch-Out!!, Mac totally deserves it.

Sin & Punishment Series [NEW]
    Saki

Figured he could get in, seeing how he was an Assist in Brawl, finally got his game released here via the VC, and even got a sequel.

Starfy Series [NEW]
    Starfy

Again, he was Assist in Brawl and his most recent game got a US release, which they made a pretty big deal out of at the time.

Drill Dozer [NEW]
    Jill

I...kinda only added her on the basis of being an Assist in Brawl. Would be nice to see something by Game Freak that isn't Pokeymanz related.

Custom Robo Series [NEW]
    Ray*

Added him because he was an Assist (again). However, the one in Brawl was Ray Mk III from Custom Robo DS. If not him, I can also see them adding Ray-01 from Custom Robo on GCN. Would be nice to see a character roughly the size of Olimar but with the same firepower as Samus.


Golden Sun Series [NEW]
    Issac

Similar to Mac, he was an Assist in Brawl and his series recently got a brand new sequel. A lot of people would be happy to see him get in, I'm certain.

Advance Wars Series [NEW]
    Sami
    Infantry

Threw in Sami because she debuted in the first Wars game to be released outside Japan, plus she's probably the Orange Star CO with the most moveset potential. Added an Infantry soldier because the Infantry have appeared as an Assist Trophy in Brawl and as characters of their own in Captain Rainbow. I know this is kind of a long shot as far as possibility goes, but I think Advance Wars is a criminally underrated series and kinda deserves at least one character.

Jam with the Band / Master of Illusion [NEW]
    Barbara*

She was an Assist Trophy in Brawl, sure, but her debut game got a European release last year, and she also has a cameo in Master of Illusion, which WAS released in the US.

Excitebike Series [NEW]
    Biker

This is probably the most ridiculous choice I have on here, but hear me out. He had a trophy in Melee and an entire Assist Trophy in Brawl. If he were to get in, I can see him controlling similarly to Wheelie from Kirby Super Star. All of his attacks can involve him sideswiping people with his bike or burning them with the Nitro exhaust. He also has hands, so its not like he can't pick up items.

Balloon Fight Series [NEW]
    Alice

Again, this is a pretty long shot, but Balloon Fight was recognized in Melee via a hidden music track on the Icicle Mountain stage, and then again in Brawl via the fish on the Summit stage. Clearly they like this little series to some degree. Rather than add a generic Balloonist as a character, I thought it best to use the protagonist of Balloon Kid, the only edition of Balloon Fight with a storyline.

Mach Rider Series [NEW]
    Mach Rider*

Like Balloon Fight, he was recognized in Melee via a hidden music track on Big Blue and also via a Trophy. Masahiro Sakurai has also gone on record saying Mach Rider is one of his favorite characters. Admit it, you know playing as a cyborg that can break into a million pieces would be awesome.

Magical Vacation/Starsign [NEW]
    Mokka

I thought Magical Vacation/Starsign should have a character but only Magical Starsign was released outside Japan, so I went with this guy because he appeared as a Trophy in Brawl. Always better to have another robot, I say.

Ouendan Series/Elite Beat Agents [NEW]
    Agent J

*Both the Agents and the Cheer Squad appear as Trophies in Brawl, but I decided to leave it at Agent J since he also appears in the sequel in Japan. The other two agents would appear during his Final Smash.

Nazo no Murasamejo [NEW]
    Takamaru

At first I wouldn't have thought to put him on this list, but not only was Nazo no Mursamejo was represented through a music track in Brawl, but in last year's Samura Warriors 3 added an ENTIRE MODE dedicated to Nazo no Murasamejo along with Takamaru as a playable character. And yes, this DID get a US release.

Wii [NEW]
    Mii

Initially I didn't think the Mii would make a viable character. Then Wii Sports Resort came out and introduced the Swordplay game. Thus, the Mii appears in full fencing garb and fights with the foam sword. The Mii's face is determined by the one you picked for your online profile, or if you didn't choose it's randomly selected from the Miis in your Mii Plaza.

Third Party Games
    Snake
    Sonic
    Mega Man*
    Simon Belmont*

Kept Snake and Sonic as I doubt they'll be dropped. Added Mega Man because everyone was clamoring for him during Brawl's release. Added Simon Belmont for sheer retro value (team him up with Mega Man and Pit and you get the cast of Captain N) and because he's a Konami character that actually debuted on a Nintendo console.

Not a character request per se, but costumes.

Yeah, but after you start changing the models and effects you start to leave "costume" territory and wind up in "new character" territory.
Title: Re: All right now who do ya want in Smash Bros. 4
Post by: Weegee on April 30, 2011, 02:02:58 PM
I would guess that Zoroark will replace Mewtwo/Lucario.

Anyway, behold what happens when Asperger's Syndrome and gaming collide:

http://videogamefanon.wikia.com/wiki/Super_Smash_Bros._Unleashed
Title: Re: All right now who do ya want in Smash Bros. 4
Post by: BP on April 30, 2011, 05:55:32 PM
I thought Zoroark was likely but then realized, well, it's not actually getting a lot of publicity despite being the first gen 5'er. I bet it gets its own [dukar]ty movie later on though! And talks!

It'd still be a somewhat poor design choice from a having-logic-brains point of view if you ask me, considering how exclusive it is as an event Pokémon. I can't think of anything to compare the situation to...

@ Chef Man: Ninten has potential, that being Ana's moves that never appeared in the later EarthBound games. Brain Cyclone and PK Beam and stuff. He had his own teleport move only for escaping battles. But I'd rather they bring in a character with no PSI, especially Duster or Teddy. There I go, fantasizing about how each, any and all playable EB characters would work in Smash Bros THANKS FOR SETTING ME OFF YOU SHOULDA KNOWN TO NOT DO THAT

I still have to strongly contest the idea of playable Miis in games with real playable characters. They ain't got no souls man
Title: Re: All right now who do ya want in Smash Bros. 4
Post by: Weegee on April 30, 2011, 06:09:46 PM
I bet it gets its own [dukar]ty movie later on though! And talks!

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pok%C3%A9mon:_Zoroark:_Master_of_Illusions

I'd still like to see the player character from Animal Crossing. It would make more sense than Tom Nook, in my humble-yet-correct opinion.
Title: Re: All right now who do ya want in Smash Bros. 4
Post by: CoconutMikeNIke on April 30, 2011, 06:20:52 PM
At least with Player Character the options for his/her attacks would he easy. Use the fishing pole for ^B, shovel for vB, I guess bug net for smash B, dunno for nuetral, and their [whatever replaces the Final Smash] could have the train or taxi storm through.

On the other hand, Tom could pay the other characters off, or hit them with his massive tanuki scrotum. And that would be great. 

I don't really know of anyone new to put in, though I like the idea of an Advance Wars character, but I hope they make it so you can save the setting for match types, and be able to name them. Then you can just hit one thing to play by either stick-in-the-mud type rules (Fox only, no items, Final Destination), or kooky, no-idea-what's-happening.

Also, I hope they keep R.O.B., but that's mostly because that's who I'm best with.
Title: Re: All right now who do ya want in Smash Bros. 4
Post by: The Chef on April 30, 2011, 06:45:03 PM
I have a feeling they never intended to put an Animal Crossing character in there. They overcompensated for it by having a stage and like ten million songs, stickers and trophies.
Title: Re: All right now who do ya want in Smash Bros. 4
Post by: PaperLuigi on April 30, 2011, 07:56:48 PM
I would guess that Zoroark will replace Mewtwo/Lucario.

I would hate that. They can have him in it if and only if Mewtwo comes back.
Title: Re: All right now who do ya want in Smash Bros. 4
Post by: BP on April 30, 2011, 08:22:20 PM
Even if I totally hate Animal Crossing I respect its presence in Brawl for what it is. It's really perfect, if you think about it. It's not really a game at all, and it's kinda just theeeeeeeere, so, what better way to represent it than from a Switzerland point of view
/me is a total hypocrite when it comes to Phoenix Wright and Marvel vs. Capcom though, but what are you gonna do about that
Title: Re: All right now who do ya want in Smash Bros. 4
Post by: BP on April 30, 2011, 09:26:11 PM
Captain Rainbow
Title: Re: All right now who do ya want in Smash Bros. 4
Post by: Weegee on April 30, 2011, 11:10:39 PM
...AKA "The Hero From a Game That's Only Known Outside of Japan For Having Birdo as a Minor Character". Maybe his appearance could be included as Captain Falcon's fabulous alternate outfit, though.
Title: Re: All right now who do ya want in Smash Bros. 4
Post by: Ultima Shadow on May 01, 2011, 01:21:25 AM
Yeah, but after you start changing the models and effects you start to leave "costume" territory and wind up in "new character" territory.

Even if said characters are functionally exactly the same except for an aesthetic change? It'd be a good way to cut down on unnecessary characters, not to mention clones.

Anyway, behold what happens when Asperger's Syndrome and gaming collide:

http://videogamefanon.wikia.com/wiki/Super_Smash_Bros._Unleashed

I liked how Ridley was a character, Assist Trophy and boss all at once.
Title: Re: All right now who do ya want in Smash Bros. 4
Post by: Toad on May 01, 2011, 07:05:26 AM
They must be confusing Ridley for Chuck Norris.

I think Toad should be the Mario character they add to this game. After Toad, you start getting into characters from the Mario series that have only appeared in spinoffs or are just slightly less deserving. Toad has been there since the series began and I am surprised he hasn't been playable yet. Sure, he's Peach's sheild, but that doesn't mean he can't be playable too. Captain Falcon's car appears in the background of the F-Zero stages, yet you can still use it in his Final Smash. And don't even get me started on the he's too generic arguement..

I like the idea of Dixie and K Rool becoming playable. Maybe K Rool could have a costume that dresses him in his Kaptain garb.
Title: Re: All right now who do ya want in Smash Bros. 4
Post by: ShadowBrain on May 01, 2011, 07:48:22 AM
If it's uniqueness (and distancing from Peach's moveset) people are worried about, may I suggest Toadsworth instead? Also, I'm totally down with K. Rool with a Kaptain costume, and Bowser Jr. is just fine too (although I have this nagging feeling he'd end up really annoying). Meanwhile, my only problem with Ridley is that as a recurring foe in the Metroid series, he's not had much in the way of humanization or character development. I'm not saying we need that for a fighting game, but it may be one of the reasons why he hasn't shown up yet.
Title: Re: All right now who do ya want in Smash Bros. 4
Post by: Turtlekid1 on May 01, 2011, 07:51:17 AM
I'd really like to see Ridley but the problem is that he's just too big compared to other characters.
Title: Re: All right now who do ya want in Smash Bros. 4
Post by: The Chef on May 01, 2011, 10:30:53 AM
I already pointed out that while I'd like to see Toad, it would be fine if they didn't add him so long as they didn't add any more Mario characters than what we have.

I also pointed out that even though Ridley could work as a playable character, being a boss makes him look more impressive both visually and mechanically.
Title: Re: All right now who do ya want in Smash Bros. 4
Post by: Toad on May 01, 2011, 04:46:59 PM
may I suggest Toadsworth instead

NO
He has been playable zero times, and contributes nothing to the series. He could easily be replaced with the Toad (and some lines in the RPG's changed around just a hair, since Toad isn't that old) but.. that's a rant for another time. Also, I don't hate Toadsworth..

Toad would be an awesome playable character, and is the last deserving Mario character whether people like it or not. Bowser Jr would be a good representative for the Koopa family (besides good old dad, of course) but I feel he's too.. new. I know that sounds completely ignorant since characters from Pokemon and Fire Emblem got in, but I feel that Toad should the next playable Mario character before anybody else.

Moving on: Bowser Jr would actually be neat, if they made him similar to Sheik/Zelda or Pokemon Trainer, as far as having a transromation move anyway. I could see him being a smaller clone of both Bowser and Mario if he had a move where he transforms into Shadow Mario.
Title: Re: All right now who do ya want in Smash Bros. 4
Post by: CoconutMikeNIke on May 01, 2011, 06:30:30 PM
If they added Bowser Jr., I would want instead of alt colors, he would have skins of the other Koopalings, because it would annoy people who hate Jr. and want them back.
Title: Re: All right now who do ya want in Smash Bros. 4
Post by: BP on May 01, 2011, 07:09:01 PM
You really COULD come up with a workable moveset for To (http://stacksmash.kontek.net/?p=13432)ad,  Ice Balls, propellor blocks, veggie pluckin' with differences from Her Highness' tossed in there like bombs or slow shells, stuff and stuff NOT from Wario's effing Woods. Toad's no more generic than Yoshi is. Just a smaller fanbase and only one starring role.

Toadsworth belongs in the trophy gallery man, use your head. He hasn't even been in a main Mario game since, what, NSMBDS? I think he's an okay character but he's an old pacifistic man who probably has fungal hemorrhoids

Bowser Jr. wouldn't be too bad an add either (I think Bowser himself is due for a move overhaul), and I don't think adding both him and Toad to the Mario characters who were in Brawl would be too much or too imbalanced. Mario is huge, after all.
Title: Re: All right now who do ya want in Smash Bros. 4
Post by: Weegee on May 01, 2011, 07:22:31 PM
Mario is huge, after all.

He's just big-boned.
Title: Re: All right now who do ya want in Smash Bros. 4
Post by: BP on May 01, 2011, 07:42:17 PM
What's your excuse
Title: Re: All right now who do ya want in Smash Bros. 4
Post by: The Chef on May 01, 2011, 08:07:16 PM
If they added Bowser Jr., I would want instead of alt colors, he would have skins of the other Koopalings, because it would annoy people who hate Jr. and want them back.

That wouldn't work at all. Kinda hard to make a skin out of a character roughly three times larger than you.
Title: Re: All right now who do ya want in Smash Bros. 4
Post by: BP on May 01, 2011, 09:00:49 PM
He said skins; recoloring Bowser Jr. to look like his bros in his alts is a realistic idea. If they wanted to be REALLY cool they'd give his pink one shades and his blue one glasses.

But for some reason only the Pokémon get varying models and they only get four alternates, lazy-ass artists at Nintendo
Title: Re: All right now who do ya want in Smash Bros. 4
Post by: Weegee on May 01, 2011, 09:44:41 PM
What's your excuse

/me this cyber-bullying is killing Weegee on the inside
Title: Re: All right now who do ya want in Smash Bros. 4
Post by: Toad on May 02, 2011, 05:02:21 PM
You really COULD come up with a workable moveset for To (http://stacksmash.kontek.net/?p=13432)ad,  Ice Balls, propellor blocks, veggie pluckin' with differences from Her Highness' tossed in there like bombs or slow shells, stuff and stuff NOT from Wario's effing Woods. Toad's no more generic than Yoshi is. Just a smaller fanbase and only one starring role.

Toadsworth belongs in the trophy gallery man, use your head. He hasn't even been in a main Mario game since, what, NSMBDS? I think he's an okay character but he's an old pacifistic man who probably has fungal hemorrhoids

Bowser Jr. wouldn't be too bad an add either (I think Bowser himself is due for a move overhaul), and I don't think adding both him and Toad to the Mario characters who were in Brawl would be too much or too imbalanced. Mario is huge, after all.

I agree with all that, but why not add stuff from Wario's Woods? His vB could also pull out bombs on occasion, with the same power of Link or Toon Link's bombs.

Final Smash: I.. don't know.. :(
I thought one time that the battlefield taking on the look of Toad's House from SMB3 would work, but that just reinforces the Toad is generic arguement (not every single one of those houses is Toads..)
Title: Re: All right now who do ya want in Smash Bros. 4
Post by: BP on May 02, 2011, 05:57:03 PM
why not add stuff from Wario's Woods?

Because nobody cares about it.

Final Smash, well. You could take the NSMBW references/extension of Mario's powers concept further and give him a real Starman or maybe stretch it a little and give him a Mega Mushroom. Pick a box. Now think outside of it.

Also, I like to think Toad the character IS in every SMB3/NSMBW Mushroom House, like how Mumbo apparently has 15 or so houses in Banjo-Kazooie and -Tooie spread through the levels.

Now... how about Tetra
Title: Re: All right now who do ya want in Smash Bros. 4
Post by: Weegee on May 02, 2011, 05:58:28 PM
She could be Toon Zelda's alternate form.
Title: Re: All right now who do ya want in Smash Bros. 4
Post by: The Chef on May 02, 2011, 07:04:49 PM
Old Toad moveset I came up with to the best of my memory:

A - Kick
Side A - Side Kick
Down A - Low Kick
Up A - Small Headbutt

Side Smash - Headbutt
Down Smash - Breakdance Headbutt (kinda like Wario's)
Up Smash - Upward Headbutt

Air - Kick
Forward Air - Rolling Headbutt (kinda like Yoshi's)
Back Air - Falling Headbutt (again, kinda like Wario's)
Down Air - Head Dive (works like Link's downward thrust)
Up Air - Flipping Headbutt

Running A - Head Slide (kinda like Dedede's)

Grab - SMB2 Lift
Grab A -  Ground slam (like repeatedly lifting and putting down an object in Wario's Woods)
Forward Throw - SMB2 Throw
Back Throw - Reverse SMB2 Throw
Down Throw - Stack Escape (based on Wario's Woods where Toad teleports to the top of a stack of objects)
Up Throw - Headbutt Launch

B - Mushroom Cap (hides under a giant Mushroom Cap. Works similarly to Peach's B move. Based on the ending to World 6 in SMAS)
Side B - (I honestly can't remember. I think it might've had something to do with spores)
Down B - Vegetable (Same as Peach's Down B, except Toad can also get Bombs, Shells, Stopwatches or POW Blocks)
Up B - Either Power Squat Jump (based on the SMB2 move) or Propeller Jump (based on the Propeller Suit from NSMBWii). I can't remember which.

Final Smash - Giant Vegetable from SMA. You only have one shot at hitting all the other players in succession and causing massive damage.
Title: Re: All right now who do ya want in Smash Bros. 4
Post by: Ultima Shadow on May 03, 2011, 03:48:49 AM
Toad? (http://themushroomkingdom.net/board/index.php?topic=11427.msg502692#msg502692)

I would also not be totally opposed to Waluigi making an appearance. It'd be a good opportunity to flesh out what little character he has.

But more than characters, I think what SSB4 needs is an image overhaul. As much as I liked the orchestra music in SSBB, the story mode seemed to be taking itself a bit too seriously, and for what is in essence part of a multiplayer party game, it seemed a bit out of place. Despite all of the accolades previously given to the writers, it just seemed to flow like a badly-written fanfiction. Let the game have a bit of fun in its single player and let the writers take the **** out of it a bit.
Title: Re: All right now who do ya want in Smash Bros. 4
Post by: The Chef on May 03, 2011, 10:39:20 AM
I've been saying for a while that the next SSB should have an enhanced version of Melee's Adventure Mode rather than a full-on story mode.

I'd also be in favor of it having multiple Adventure Modes a la Kirby Super Star (since that seems to be where the whole "game within a game" thing surrounding tSsE comes from). One can be like the original where you just progress from one stage to the next. One can have a map like tSsE did. One can be a Metroidvania (rather than having "The Great Maze" be a stage within the main mode, which was a load of bull), and the last one....I dunno, but it would have to shake things up quite a bit.
Title: Re: All right now who do ya want in Smash Bros. 4
Post by: Luigison on May 03, 2011, 12:18:25 PM
(https://themushroomkingdom.net/board/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fdefaultprime.com%2Fwp-content%2Fuploads%2F2010%2F01%2Fryuta_kawashima_brain_age.jpg&hash=6ade860c57532a94877c187796ac28ec)
He throws math or word problems at you and you have to press the correct button or sequence. 

(https://themushroomkingdom.net/board/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.techdigest.tv%2Fassets_c%2F2009%2F03%2Ftom-nook-thumb-300x385-82623.jpg&hash=67440e17b45791b8c5f6fa84d9c4e245)
He throws AC items and you. 

Title: Re: All right now who do ya want in Smash Bros. 4
Post by: Lizard Dude on May 03, 2011, 12:36:48 PM
I'd really like to see Ridley but the problem is that he's just too big compared to other characters.
(https://themushroomkingdom.net/board/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.vizzed.com%2Fvizzedboard%2Fnes%2Fnescafe%2Fsavescreens%2F47564-METROID.gif&hash=bf108b12f46bdbc36d448e22c872f520)  (https://themushroomkingdom.net/board/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.vgthought.com%2Fwp-content%2Fuploads%2F2010%2F06%2Fbowser_sunshine.png&hash=a6575a6c76c04612c764152d9ab87b7e)

*shrug*
Title: Re: All right now who do ya want in Smash Bros. 4
Post by: Turtlekid1 on May 03, 2011, 03:19:02 PM
Neither of those are how the characters are most consistently portrayed, though.

(https://themushroomkingdom.net/board/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.ukonlinegames.com%2Fwp-content%2Fuploads%2F2010%2F06%2FRidleySuperMetroid_thumb.jpg&hash=bbc47caf34f2369124232e1cba55348f)
(https://themushroomkingdom.net/board/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fstatic.gamesradar.com%2Fimages%2Fmb%2FGamesRadar%2Fus%2FFeatures%2F2008%2F10%2FMario%2520Bowser%2520comparison%2FFinished%2F100208_mariobowser_obs06--article_image.jpg&hash=672442c92dca49a6509ca285e4f59b71)
Title: Re: All right now who do ya want in Smash Bros. 4
Post by: The Chef on May 03, 2011, 03:22:40 PM
Like I said, Ridley would be nice if he were playable, but I think being a boss does him the most amount of justice.
Title: Re: All right now who do ya want in Smash Bros. 4
Post by: Turtlekid1 on May 03, 2011, 03:26:11 PM
I wanna see a fighter designed for all the giant characters in games.  Ridley, Kraid, Sunshine/Galaxy 2!Bowser, pretty much any boss from lots of Zelda games...
Title: Re: All right now who do ya want in Smash Bros. 4
Post by: ShadowBrain on May 03, 2011, 04:30:54 PM
I'm pretty sure the Ridley comment was a troll joke.
Title: Re: All right now who do ya want in Smash Bros. 4
Post by: Kojinka on May 03, 2011, 04:31:34 PM
What they need to do is give Ganondorf's moveset a complete overhaul. When do you ever see him throw punches in battle on the Zelda games?  I sure haven't.  Give him some projectiles and one of his swords!  I was quite disappointed when I found out he was still a Falcon semi-clone in Brawl.  To add insult to injury, they had to cocktease us with that taunt where he pulls out the sword.
Title: Re: All right now who do ya want in Smash Bros. 4
Post by: The Chef on May 03, 2011, 08:07:03 PM
At least they managed to de-clone him somewhat in Brawl. At this point I doubt they'll change it any further than that.
Title: Re: All right now who do ya want in Smash Bros. 4
Post by: BP on May 03, 2011, 11:46:26 PM
Somebody made a moveset mod for him where that taunt actually has him pull the sages' sword out and use it (or, in an alternate version, a Darknut's sword). As could be expected it's kind of a... wobbly... job. He feels pretty overpowered and I can't actually tell what one of his moves is supposed to do.

Also he flips you off if he loses.
Title: Re: All right now who do ya want in Smash Bros. 4
Post by: Ultima Shadow on May 04, 2011, 04:12:04 AM
What they need to do is give Ganondorf's moveset a complete overhaul. When do you ever see him throw punches in battle on the Zelda games?  I sure haven't.  Give him some projectiles and one of his swords!  I was quite disappointed when I found out he was still a Falcon semi-clone in Brawl.  To add insult to injury, they had to cocktease us with that taunt where he pulls out the sword.

I'm kinda glad he doesn't use the sword, we have enough sword characters as it is. Brawling warlocks, not so much.
Title: Re: All right now who do ya want in Smash Bros. 4
Post by: Kojinka on May 04, 2011, 11:01:19 AM
He can keep the kicks, and maybe one or two punches.   I'm just saying that his moveset in Smash Bros. seems a bit out of place because in Zelda, he usually fights with swords or projectile spells.  Granted you don't usually see Zelda in combat, but the games at least hint that she would be quite good in battle with her magic spells.
Title: Re: All right now who do ya want in Smash Bros. 4
Post by: BP on July 09, 2011, 01:14:00 AM
I've been thinking lately that King Hippo would be pretty cool to have in alongside Little Mac. He's got somewhat iconic status as a Punch-Out!! character, for the trick it takes to beat him... he's the first character in the Wii game who stands out as being more than a joke. I guess he owes some of his fame to his being on Captain N, but the point is that he has fame.

He'd also be the only large character (in the same ranks as Donkey Kong, Bowser, Dedede and Charizard) to be a human... which is debatable, now that I think of it.

Seems to be like an unspoken rule among wish list makers to only allow one character per new wanted franchise, only ever the main hero, and for another-time-another-place series, only ever the main hero from the first game. Admittedly it'd be weird to have Isaac and Matthew together at the same time as the same age... I should play a Golden Sun sometime

-------------------

Also lately I've been thinking more and more that instead of a game that adds on to Brawl and attempts to render it, Melee and 64 obsolete and not worth playing, I'd rather have a new game altogether. I can think of dozens of ways I'd change Mario, Luigi, Samus, and Kirby. I'd like to see a large chunk of the characters gone, and not replaced.

"But BP what about people who would miss their favorite characters or not want to learn their new moves," you ask. That is part of my point here. I have a lot of ideas for possible ways to refresh the EarthBound roster* and a few of them involve removing Ness, my favorite character in the game. I want a NEW game, and if I want to play the old one, well, I still own the old ones, and there's no logical reason I should WANT a game that would make me never want to play them again. There's not ENOUGH to add, but so much that could be changed. Too bad that'll never happen because Nintendo doesn't have the balls to do that to all the whiners who wouldn't understand...

*For the curious, they're all combinations of three characters from the series, one from each game. Ness (redone)/Kumatora/Teddy is my favorite idea but I'd be cool with Lucas/Ana/Jeff or Lucas/Loid/Poo or Ness/Loid/Duster or Ninten/Jeff/Boney or... really almost anything that gave spotlight to one main character and two friends. And made the main character's moveset accurate, if one of the supporting characters was one of the PSI-specialized girls.
Title: Re: All right now who do ya want in Smash Bros. 4
Post by: The Chef on July 09, 2011, 09:32:49 AM
Me and Warp already made a case for why Lucas, Ike, Wolf and Toon Link could stand to be removed.

And I've said in the past that if the entire Smash series had been left up to me since the beginning, there'd only be one or two characters from each "logo" as opposed to like four or five. MvC2 taught us that inflated rosters are pretty lousy, and having less from each logo would probably allow more room for other series (like maybe Issac or Little Mac or someone).
Title: Re: All right now who do ya want in Smash Bros. 4
Post by: billy chilly on July 09, 2011, 10:47:19 AM
Oh man, I gotta disagree there. 

Some logos are more important, and WAY more famous than others, and I think they deserve more representation.  Mario, Pokemon and Zelda absolutely earned their high number of characters in the Smash Bros. series, and I wouldn't have it any other way. 

People consider MvC2 lousy?  I'm not being a smart-ass, I'm really asking. I'm not on the tournament fighter scene at all, but I was under the impression MvC2 was a classic and a huge mainstay in the world of tourney fighters.  Personally I think big rosters are great, they give a fighter a lot of replay value and depth.  Granted there is a point where it would start to get ridiculous, but if you factor in the characters that wouldn't "need" to return (clones) and the ones that probably won't return (Snake and Sonic), I don't think we're at that ridiculous point yet. 

I love Smash Bros. because it has famous faces like LInk and Pikachu battling alongside old school, obscure weirdos like the Ice Climbers and Game and Watch.  I'd be VERY sad if Smash 4 changed that.  I could see Lucas, Ike, Lucario, Wolf and Toon Link getting the ax, but like the jump from Melee to Brawl, most of them would probably get replaced by a new, similar character.  Which is a-ok with me.  Sakurai can just confirm Zoroark taking over Lucario's spot if you ask me.  Other than that, I'd like to see the following added:

First party characters:
-Ridley
-LIttle Mac.  Just like Pit debuted as a trophy before being playable, I think Little Mac deserves the same.  Punch-Out Wii is an underrated gem.
-Samurai Goroh.  Like Metroid, the F-Zero series needs some love, stat!
-Zoroark to take over Lucario's spot, as mentioned above.
-Someone from Advance Wars.  I'm not familiar with the series, but it has a great visual style and has been pretty successful for a few years now. It's earned it's place, and it's flagship character could be a good fill-in for Snake, if he's not coming back.  Actually, just going by visuals alone, I'd probably pick Sami.  She's cool and looks bad-ass.  It's always nice to add a girl to the roster, and she's pretty different from the ladies we currently have.
-Crazy, out of left-field surprise character (ala Ice Climbers, Game and Watch, Pit): Mach Rider.  The gritty grizzled road war from a post-apocalyptic future would DEFINITELY add some flavor to the line-up, and maybe, like Sami, do a good job at filling in the void Snake may be leaving.  Also he could race motorcycles with Wario. ;)

Wow, I thought there were more first party characters that I wanted in the game, but I guess not?  I think this is a pretty reasonable/plausible list of additions.  Really, it's all about Ridley for me.  Metroid is my favorite series, and Ridley is essentially Metroid's Bowser or Ganondorf.  His moveset writes itself.  Yeah he's huge, but so is Bowser.  The difference is that Ridley is near-skeletal, he's super lanky.  I feel like having him being (relatively) low-weight would go a long way to balancing him, even making him a tough character to master (huge and low-weight?  In Smash Bros?  Yikes!).

I think alternate costumes would go a long way to adding (albeit artificial) roster depth.  We've only started to see this in Smash Bros, with Wario's costume change, and some color swaps that are based on other characters:  Peach has had a color swap for Daisy, Mario and Luigi have had color swaps for different power-ups and Wario/Waluigi, Samus has had color swaps based on her other suits, etc.  But why stop with one character and some meaningful color swaps?  Let's get a full-blown Daisy or Rosalina in there!  Raccoon Mario!  Bee Luigi!  Oni-Link!  Dark Suit Samus!  Dry Bowser!  Looie (for Olimar)! Different generations of Pokemon trainers!  Just like with Wario's two costumes, the character stays the same, but visually they're a little different.  I'd love to see this.  Hell, they could be unlockable even!  Honestly, at this point, I think I'd prefer this over trophies.  I mean, what's left to make trophies of?  The trophy galleries are wonderful, but I feel like they must be a pretty big chunk of development time too.  With alternate costumes, we still get that taste of Nintendo history, but in the form of something we can enjoy while playing the game. 

If third party characters come back I'd like to see:
-Classic Mega Man.  The fact that he wasn't in Brawl blows my mind.  But maybe we can fix that in Smash 4. :)
-Simon Belmont.  Maybe not as much of a "duh" pick as Mega Man, but not far off.  Simon (and importantly, his level) would rule.
-Pac-Man.  Can't hardly get more classic than good ol' Pac-Man.  His level would be awesome too.

I can take or leave Sonic and Snake.  They were both great, and did an awesome job of mixing things up, but I won't be crying if they sit out Smash 4 either.  It WAS pretty rad to finally see Mario and Sonic beat each other's faces in, even if it was about 15 years late.:)

I could also take or leave Final Smashes.  I really enjoyed them in Brawl, but I won't be too worked up if they don't come back either. 

Please, for the love of God, change Mario's down+B to an actual attack again.  I don't even care what it is, as long as it's better than a non-damaging FLUDD blast.  Luigi needs to have an attack or 2 based on the Poltergust.  Maybe his final smash?  I'd like that.
Title: Re: All right now who do ya want in Smash Bros. 4
Post by: CoconutMikeNIke on July 09, 2011, 12:29:55 PM
Well if offbeat/not the hero/weird characters are the way we're going, i would want Brian (I think that's his name) from Quest 64, Evo from Space station Silicon Valley, and a Team Rocket member (any grunt would be fine, but the nostalgia in me says Jesse and James with their originals and Meowth. Nostalgias also the reason for Rocket and not any of the teams from the last few gens).

I like the characters with multiple forms, which is what I'd hope Evo and the other PKMN trainer would be, evo having like an Elephant tank form, rocket turtle or Rat King form, and maybe a penguin or King Penguin. Something that can sort of fly. Rocket member could have, well, Arbok, Weezing and Meowth is my preference, and I don't really know what the attacks for them might be.

MvC2 is broken by it's infinites. Chars like Magneto who have a handfull of infinite combos, while certainly not "ruined forevar", made me at least lose some amount of interest.

Finally, while looking on Wikipedia trying to remember Evos name, did you know Space Station Silicon Valley was made by what would be Rockstar North? They should go back to the silly goofy games once in a while, diversify from the GTA stuff a bit. 
Title: Re: All right now who do ya want in Smash Bros. 4
Post by: The Chef on July 09, 2011, 01:46:19 PM
If they're gonna use up what minimal third party space they have, they ain't using it on Quest 64 and Space Station Silicon Valley.

Quote
Ridley

It always bugs me when people suggest him because he's already appared as a boss, and making him playable would cause him to look considerably less impressive and powerful by comparison. I feel that being a boss does Ridley's entire character better justice.
Title: Re: All right now who do ya want in Smash Bros. 4
Post by: BP on July 09, 2011, 02:58:32 PM
I'd be VERY sad if Smash 4 changed

What is the point of a series where each unique entry makes you never want to play the previous ones again? I guess if we were still where SSB64 was, it'd be reasonable... but how much is not in Brawl that could be added to the next one where you'd say, "Yes; this needed to happen, this is a large step up."

Should've been easy to see this situation coming, though. Brawl's trailer was like, "Anti-hero from Kirby! Hero from really old game! Samus, except not in a Power Suit! And Wario! ...okay here's one: Snake!" If all they're gonna do is add a few characters and not change some of the ones already there, I can imagine they'll have a tough time making a trailer where all the hype doesn't hinge on Mega Man... and if he's not in...

Code: [Select]
A SSB4 roster that would make me happy

 Super Mario
  1. Mario (New moves)
  2. Luigi (New moves)
  3. Bowser (Tweaked moves)
  4. Yoshi  (Tweaked moves)

 Donkey Kong Country
  5. Donkey Kong (Possibly tweaked moves)
  6. Diddy Kong

 The Legend of Zelda
  7. Link (Skyward Sword or Ocarina of Time)
  8. Zelda (The Wind Waker)
+   /9. Tetra
 10. Ganondorf (Twilight Princess, new moves)

 Metroid
 11. Samus (Tweaked moves, maybe put her in the Fusion Suit)
+12. Ridley (Yeah, shut up Chef)

 Kirby
 13. Kirby (New moves)
 14. Meta Knight
 15. King Dedede

 Star Fox
 16. Fox

 Pokémon
 17. Pikachu
+18. Hilbert or Hilda (those are apparently the names of Black and White's playable characters--replaces Red)
  +19. Snivy
  +20. Dewott
  +21. Emboar
+22. Scrafty

 EarthBound
 23. Ness (New/tweaked moves)
+24. Kumatora
+25. Teddy

 Fire Emblem
 26. Marth
+27. Whoever (Lyn? Eliwood? I should play a Fire Emblem)

 Ice Climber
 28. Ice Climbers

 Game & Watch
 29. Mr. Game & Watch

 Kid Icarus
 30. Pit
+31. Medusa

 Pikmin
 32. Olimar

+Punch-Out!!
+33. Little Mac
+34. King Hippo

+Golden Sun
+35. Isaac
+36. Felix

+The Legendary Starfy
+37. Starfy

+Sin And Punishment
+38. Saki

+Drill Dozer
+39. Jill

+Captain Rainbow
+40. Captain Rainbow


Guests

 Metal Gear
 41. Solid Snake
 
 Sonic The God[darn] Mother****ing Hedgehog
 42. Sonic
 
+Mega Man
+43. Mega Man

Code: [Select]
Mario's new moves (representative of games SMW and earlier)
B:      Fire Mario: Faster, stronger, more range
Side-B: Hammer Mario: Mario chucks a hammer.
Up B:   Cape Mario: On ground, a caped spin (he WEARS the cape, [darnit]) In air, a caped spin jump. Deflects projectiles.
Down B: Shoe Mario: Mario hops and stomps with Kuribo's Shoe.

Code: [Select]
Luigi's new moves (representative of games NSMB and later)
B:      Ice Luigi: An ice ball instead of a fireball.
Side-B: Shell Luigi: slides forward inside a blue shell. Can jump.
Up-B:   Propellor Luigi: An absurdly high jump. You can flutter down gently or drill down fast to attack.
Down B: Spring Luigi: Uses a spring wrapped around his body to create a shockwave

But don't worry about it, I'm sure this won't happen. Like I say, Nintendo doesn't have the balls to do this because they know their fans are too conservative to understand
Title: Re: All right now who do ya want in Smash Bros. 4
Post by: CoconutMikeNIke on July 09, 2011, 03:04:07 PM
 Alright, I'll admit Quest was a shot in the dark, but SSSV would at least be understandable. I don't know if you know this, Rockstars kinda big, well known enough that they could get a character in. And of the characters that you could choose are pretty much Dude from GTA, Dude from GTA III, Dude from Red Dead, Dude from GTA IV. They had give Snake a whole bunch of explosives because guns were ruled out and that's a pretty big part of that, (especially when you suck at stealth, which doesn't work with the Smash gametype) but you couldn't really do that with the Average Joe Renegade. And it's not like SSSV would be the most obscure. Pit, Ice Climbers, and ROB were all one off just okay platformers or failed control things. May as well throw in the guy from Burger Time, at least that was good.

And Ridley I could go either way on. I do want more Metroid Characters, and I don't think Ridley would be bad, but I think a different bounty hunter would be cool too. Plus, if the next Metroid is coming out around the same time, it would be great cross promotion (Assuming of course that the next one will deal with the Sylux story). And just because Ridley was a boss shouldn't exclude him, there are a bunch of bosses playable. Even Giga Bowser became playable. The only things I think should NOT become playable are the hands, and I guess Tabuu, though he could be heavily reworked to fit.

What is the point of a series where each unique entry makes you never want to play the previous ones again?

Man, good thing this isn't a fighting game we're talking about. And you want Mega Man in it? King of the "You know what to do already" genre?
Title: Re: All right now who do ya want in Smash Bros. 4
Post by: The Chef on July 09, 2011, 03:37:58 PM
@ BP:

I'm kind of sad your roster has no F-ZERO characters on it.
Title: Re: All right now who do ya want in Smash Bros. 4
Post by: WarpRattler on July 09, 2011, 03:51:52 PM
Man, good thing this isn't a fighting game we're talking about.
Later entries in fighting game franchises don't have to make previous iterations obsolete. People still play Street Fighter Alpha 2 and Street Fighter III. People still play The King of Fighters '98 and 2002. Hell, there's still a fanbase for Ultimate Mortal Kombat 3.
Title: Re: All right now who do ya want in Smash Bros. 4
Post by: The Chef on July 09, 2011, 06:21:10 PM
Look at how big a jump it was from MvC2 to MvC3. The latter uses an entirely different graphics engine and a brand new button layout.

Heck, even MvC1's button layout was different from MvC2's. It's one of the reasons I like MvC1 better.

So yeah, this is all just adding to BP's point that fighting game sequels should be more than just roster expansions.
Title: Re: All right now who do ya want in Smash Bros. 4
Post by: CoconutMikeNIke on July 09, 2011, 07:12:23 PM
What are we counting as 'unique'? Because I'd say that the difference between the three entries in the Street Fighter 4, and the fact you had to pay for each makes them unique, is little more than character additions and updates.  And that's fine. But I doubt you'll find very many competitions for Street Fighter 4 prime.  Smash already changes a good amount each game without changing so much so as to be convincingly a new series. It gives moderate graphics boost, a bunch more levels (in a game where the levels actually matter), more chars, items, modes.

I can't explain MK3, though, that's just awful.
Title: Re: All right now who do ya want in Smash Bros. 4
Post by: BP on July 09, 2011, 07:24:56 PM
I'm kind of sad your roster has no F-ZERO characters on it.

Maybe I forgot, maybe I didn't. It wouldn't really matter to me either way if he was in and actually done right, or just plain gone. The stages would have to stick, though. They're cool, they do the games justice.

And you want Mega Man in it? King of the "You know what to do already" genre?

Playing the same and BEING the same are... not the same. Mega Man games actually prove my point, they take the same concept, give Mega Man new powers, throw away the old ones, add new bosses, throw away the old ones... add new stages, throw away the old ones... thank you. Being like a Mega Man sequel is exactly what I want in SSB4.
Title: Re: All right now who do ya want in Smash Bros. 4
Post by: CoconutMikeNIke on July 16, 2011, 02:57:38 PM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=STk3jPQVjK0

Sega Satan shiro!
Title: Re: All right now who do ya want in Smash Bros. 4
Post by: billy chilly on July 16, 2011, 09:41:03 PM
I really don't get the mindset that having a huge roster in Smash 4 would somehow make Brawl any more obsolete than Brawl made Melee or Melee made Smash64.  Die hards still have Melee tournaments.  If you want to keep playing Brawl, Smash 4 having a huge awesome roster won't stop you from playing Brawl or make it "obsolete."

In the Smash Bros. games I'd say the level line-up is just as important as the character line-up, and with each installment that HAS changed drastically from game to game, with only a small handful of past levels returning.  Not only that, but the fighting engine itself changes with each installment, so I wouldn't worry about Smash 4 being a cookie-cutter sequel, unless they change their development style for it.
Title: Re: All right now who do ya want in Smash Bros. 4
Post by: BP on July 16, 2011, 10:04:02 PM
Melee absolutely made 64 obsolete and improved on it in all ways. If you're not REALLY picky about the physics and pace (and if you also don't have that much of a bone for Mewtwo and Roy) then there's not a lot Melee has that Brawl doesn't.
Title: Re: All right now who do ya want in Smash Bros. 4
Post by: Weegee on July 16, 2011, 10:11:47 PM
Die hards still have Melee tournaments.
Quote
Die hards

In other words, it's obsolete as far as normal people are concerned.
Title: Re: All right now who do ya want in Smash Bros. 4
Post by: Turtlekid1 on July 16, 2011, 10:28:06 PM
It's a good thing the crowd that cares about whether the new SSB is obsolete probably can't be considered "normal," then.
Title: Re: All right now who do ya want in Smash Bros. 4
Post by: BP on July 16, 2011, 11:05:04 PM
If you do care that much about the physics and stuff then you get the better end of the deal, because Melee and Brawl will be very different games for you--it's just, they also want to "upgrade to the new one" and let the old one catch dust, so they don't think of it that way. They just play the one they're most used to because they don't want to bother learning to play two games.
Title: Re: All right now who do ya want in Smash Bros. 4
Post by: Kimimaru on July 16, 2011, 11:44:59 PM
Melee absolutely made 64 obsolete and improved on it in all ways. If you're not REALLY picky about the physics and pace (and if you also don't have that much of a bone for Mewtwo and Roy) then there's not a lot Melee has that Brawl doesn't.

I wouldn't say Melee obsoleted the original. There are many awesome things in it that haven't returned in Melee, including several stages, attacks, items (the Bumper especially), and Board the Platforms.
Title: Re: All right now who do ya want in Smash Bros. 4
Post by: WarpRattler on July 17, 2011, 12:54:41 AM
Melee made the original obsolete for tournament play, where the only thing you mentioned that would ever come up is the attacks that were changed between games.
Title: Re: All right now who do ya want in Smash Bros. 4
Post by: CoconutMikeNIke on July 17, 2011, 12:58:22 AM
Really, Original Ness made the original obsolete for tournament play.
Title: Re: All right now who do ya want in Smash Bros. 4
Post by: BP on July 17, 2011, 02:03:21 AM
Worth playing once or twice to see/remember what it was like is not what I'm talking about here.
Title: Re: All right now who do ya want in Smash Bros. 4
Post by: Kimimaru on July 17, 2011, 02:22:46 AM
Melee made the original obsolete for tournament play, where the only thing you mentioned that would ever come up is the attacks that were changed between games.

Not exactly. Have any of you ever played the original competitively? It's different than Melee, not worse. While Melee clearly improves upon the original in many ways, it in no way obsoletes it.
Title: Re: All right now who do ya want in Smash Bros. 4
Post by: Ultima Shadow on July 17, 2011, 03:38:59 AM
Melee and Brawl have more characters, more stages, all of that good stuff, but for some reason I just prefer the gameplay of the original by far. That's not even just nostalgia talking, I only started playing SSB64 a few months before I got Melee. It just feels... more fun? Plus, I have a hell of a time spiking my friends as Falcon. :D
Title: Re: All right now who do ya want in Smash Bros. 4
Post by: WarpRattler on July 17, 2011, 09:59:00 AM
[Melee] in no way obsoletes [SSB].
Then where are all these people conducting SSB classic tournaments?

Being a "different" game isn't enough to say it's not obsolete. If it was we'd still have tournaments for Street Fighter II, Street Fighter III, Street Fighter IV, BlazBlue: Calamity Trigger, The King of Fighters '94, X-Men vs. Street Fighter, DarkStalkers, Street Fighter Alpha, Guilty Gear, and many others that are "different" from updated versions or sequels in the same series.
Title: Re: All right now who do ya want in Smash Bros. 4
Post by: Kimimaru on July 17, 2011, 11:02:15 AM
Then where are all these people conducting SSB classic tournaments?

A 2009 tournament in San Francisco. (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CRURcTDd8HM)

An entire board dedicated to tournaments (online or not). (http://www.smashboards.com/forumdisplay.php?f=208)

Just because you don't see tournaments every day it doesn't mean there aren't any. I even went to a tournament my college held last semester.
Title: Re: All right now who do ya want in Smash Bros. 4
Post by: WarpRattler on July 17, 2011, 11:35:33 AM
A few tournaments and a small section on a message board (on the Melee section of the forum, there are more posts in all but a couple of the individual character-specific discussion boards than for the entire SSB64 competitive play board) is not what I'm talking about. I'm talking big tournaments, NorCal vs. SoCal rivalries, EVO, all that stuff. Even Melty Blood, an obscure Japan-only game based on a visual novel no one has heard of, has better grounds for that claim than SSB64.
Title: Re: All right now who do ya want in Smash Bros. 4
Post by: CoconutMikeNIke on July 17, 2011, 01:02:44 PM
So, there are a few issues with this line of conversation that I think is hampering our ability to move on. 

1. Basing a games obsolesence solely on tournament play shows very little other than if you look hard enough you can probably find a Quackshot competition. It's not a standard meter nor are die hard fans that cling to a version the most valid representation of the fans.
2. SSB is actually already a decent example FOR them not becoming obsolete with each following title. Each title is different enough to the last for there to be plenty of people who have good reason to play the earlier ones. Whether it be physics, items, moves (both differing moves and the moves behaving differently), levels. But there's no reason someone would still be playing Street Fighter II Hyper Fighting. There might be people playing it, but everything it had was updated/fixed/made better in SSFIIT.
3. And finally, we're missing out on the fact that all past games of any series will become obsolete if Segata Sanshiro is playable in the next one, because it would cause an awesome-singularity of the interactive-entertainment medium.
Title: Re: All right now who do ya want in Smash Bros. 4
Post by: Kimimaru on July 17, 2011, 01:39:08 PM
SSB is actually already a decent example FOR them not becoming obsolete with each following title. Each title is different enough to the last for there to be plenty of people who have good reason to play the earlier ones. Whether it be physics, items, moves (both differing moves and the moves behaving differently), levels.

I completely agree with this.

Warp, there aren't only a few small tournaments going on; there are many taking place each day. There used to be an entire board dedicated to SSB64 on Smashboards until recently, when they decided to integrate Melee with it. I've been in the SSB64 competitive scene for 5+ years and I can say for sure that Melee does not obsolete it. Sure, there are more options, characters, and stages in Melee, but in the original the physics are much different and the combo possibilities are endless. If someone was playing Yoshi as his/her main character in the original and switched to the Yoshi in Melee, he/she would be very surprised at how much different it is controlling him.

If none of this convinces you, go ahead and play both games with some friends and see how different the experiences you'll get are.
Title: Re: All right now who do ya want in Smash Bros. 4
Post by: billy chilly on July 18, 2011, 08:46:29 AM
I wouldn't say Melee obsoleted the original. There are many awesome things in it that haven't returned in Melee, including several stages, attacks, items (the Bumper especially), and Board the Platforms.

Oh my GOD I miss Board the Platforms.  Race to the finish as well.  Smash 4 needs to put those mo-fos back into Classic mode. 
Title: Re: All right now who do ya want in Smash Bros. 4
Post by: billy chilly on July 20, 2011, 09:15:16 AM
I've been reading the Super Smash Bros. Wiki, and apparently Meowth (along with Pit, Peach, and a few others) was considered for the original SSB, but was cut due to time/budget constraints.  I'm glad I'm not the only one that thinks he'd be awesome, and I'd love to see him in Smash 4, filling the role left by the likely-leaving Lucario.  Bonus, since Meowth has a bit of a legacy (being a Generation 1 Pokemon and a major player in the anime) I could see him sticking around. 

Sakurai has said he'd like to develop Smash 4 for 3DS and WiiU, and that the two games would have some sort of connectivity.  Now this I think is a very cool opportunity.  WiiU can have the big, epic grand Smash 4, with a huge roster and such, and 3DS Smash can have a smaller-scale more "personal" experience.  What about this: Maybe 3DS Smash is a sort of "Heroes and Villains" edition, with a cast that looks something like this:

Mario
Bowser
Donkey Kong
King K. Rool
Link
Gannondorf
Samus
Ridley
Kirby
Dedede
Fox
Wolf
Pikachu
Meowth (Yeah, he's officially part of my list of characters I want in Brawl now)
Pit
Medusa
Capt. Falcon
Samurai Goroh
Little Mac
King Hippo

Basically, any Nintendo series with a Smash-worthy hero and villain is represented by their respective hero and villain. Of course, this would leave some classic smashers high and dry, like Mr. Game and Watch or even Yoshi.  I don't know enough about the Advance Wars or Fire Emblem or Mother/Earthbound guys to come up with a respective playable villain, but if they have one,  throw 'em in!  I think this could be one way to make the 3DS and WiiU Smash Bros. games unique from one another.  Being a handheld/portable title, having a smaller cast list makes sense: this is Smash Bros. Lite, on-the-go.  Connectivity?  If your WiiU wirelessly communicates with your 3DS copy of Smash 4, you can unlock some of the exclusive characters from 3DS for use in WiiU, and vice versa.   
Title: Re: All right now who do ya want in Smash Bros. 4
Post by: The Guy on August 27, 2011, 07:01:20 PM
Mario
Bowser
Donkey Kong
King K. Rool
Link
Gannondorf
Samus
Ridley
Kirby
Dedede
Fox
Wolf
Pikachu
Meowth (Yeah, he's officially part of my list of characters I want in Brawl now)
Pit
Medusa
Capt. Falcon
Samurai Goroh
Little Mac
King Hippo

This idea, plus Lucas and the Masked Man (AKA Claus, although this shouldn't be a spoiler if you've looked at Lucas's trophy for Brawl) for EB/Mother, and with Wario and Yoshi you can have Wario, Captain Syrup, Yoshi, and Kamek.
Title: Re: All right now who do ya want in Smash Bros. 4
Post by: billy chilly on September 21, 2011, 02:01:45 PM
Maybe not exactly on topic, but this was the first Smash Bros. 4 thread I could find.

How's this for a potential title: "Super Smash Bros. Universe"

Apparently it's been leaked.  Whether or not it actually gets used... well it'll be a while before we know that. 

Link: http://wii.ign.com/articles/119/1195665p1.html?RSSwhen2011-09-20_184700&RSSid=1195665&utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=feed&utm_campaign=Feed%3A+ignfeeds%2Fwii+%28IGN+Wii%29

Assuming Smash 4 continues the trend of increasing the roster size, and pulling in guest fighters (MEGA MAN PLEASE) I think this would be a very fitting name.  It's also a nice tie-in to Wii U (Smash Bros. U).
Title: Re: All right now who do ya want in Smash Bros. 4
Post by: bobbysq1337 on September 23, 2011, 07:03:42 AM
Two words: Bill Rizer.
His attacks could be the different guns from Contra.
His Final Smash should be somewhat obvious. (Hint: look in my sig)
Title: Re: All right now who do ya want in Smash Bros. 4
Post by: BP on May 27, 2013, 09:19:40 PM
Holy crap you guys (https://twitter.com/SmashBrosLeaks)
Title: Re: All right now who do ya want in Smash Bros. 4
Post by: ShadowBrain on May 27, 2013, 09:34:43 PM
Followin'.
Title: Re: All right now who do ya want in Smash Bros. 4
Post by: KoopaTrooper on June 02, 2013, 08:26:41 AM
Surprised nobody's discussed Earthworm Jim yet.
Title: Re: All right now who do ya want in Smash Bros. 4
Post by: The Chef on June 02, 2013, 09:14:19 AM
Why would we discuss Earthworm Jim?
Title: Re: All right now who do ya want in Smash Bros. 4
Post by: Tavros on June 02, 2013, 12:20:59 PM
Probably because people want him in SSB4.
Title: Re: All right now who do ya want in Smash Bros. 4
Post by: The Chef on June 03, 2013, 01:37:27 PM
Up until now, nobody's wanted him. Hence the question.
Title: Re: All right now who do ya want in Smash Bros. 4
Post by: Tavros on June 03, 2013, 03:24:32 PM
I doubt the the people here count as everybody in the universe, but enough arguing.
Title: Re: All right now who do ya want in Smash Bros. 4
Post by: noah2001 on June 03, 2013, 05:10:48 PM
(https://themushroomkingdom.net/board/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fupload.wikimedia.org%2Fwikipedia%2Fen%2Fd%2Fd3%2FMewtwo.png&hash=5f7457619c5e1f67c544dbf3399c5115) (https://themushroomkingdom.net/board/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.quickmeme.com%2Fmeme%2F3upfky%2F&hash=788a0bedb582f7318ef9daf4aa04a804)
Title: Re: All right now who do ya want in Smash Bros. 4
Post by: BP on June 03, 2013, 08:18:50 PM
I'm pretty tired of generation 1.

Beyond that, I wish Lucario would be replaced by something no one is thinking about or asking for, something that's not pushed as a mascot in any capacity. Something like Scrafty, Cacturne, Ursaring,  etc. Something tough and appealing, but still middle-of-the-road in popularity. I feel like that's the primary draw to Pokémon. There's something in there for everybody. Each one is somebody's favorite. That aspect could use its own representation beyond the assists. Maybe even have a second Pokémon Trainer with three odd ones alongside a more predictable one with starters like Red had in Brawl.

Making it into a SSB would rob the pokémon of that status, though, wouldn't it... it's not a perfect idea. But everyone whose favorite pokémon isn't a legendary, a starter, or Pikachu, and has fantasized about it getting into Smash Bros. as a playable character should understand what I'm getting at. Not that my favorite is a nobody... at least, it hasn't been in the metagame for the last three years.
Title: Re: All right now who do ya want in Smash Bros. 4
Post by: ShadowBrain on June 03, 2013, 08:21:35 PM
Deoxys? I dunno. Anything but Lucario.
Title: Re: All right now who do ya want in Smash Bros. 4
Post by: PaperLuigi on June 03, 2013, 08:22:44 PM
I would love to see Mewtwo make a reappearance. Maybe throw in his alternate form as a nod to the sixth generation.
Title: Re: All right now who do ya want in Smash Bros. 4
Post by: BP on June 03, 2013, 08:46:46 PM
(https://themushroomkingdom.net/board/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fnow-here-this.timeout.com%2Fwp-content%2Fuploads%2F2013%2F01%2Fsotd-disappointed.gif&hash=6defd82e2e24e9dea64097e815053edd)
Title: Re: All right now who do ya want in Smash Bros. 4
Post by: Weegee on June 03, 2013, 08:49:27 PM
It'll be either Zoroark or Gen VI's equivalent, sadly.
Title: Re: All right now who do ya want in Smash Bros. 4
Post by: Toad on June 03, 2013, 11:43:14 PM
Toad, because I think he's the last Mario character that deserves a playable position in this series.

After him, we start getting into spin-off characters that don't need to be playable (Waluigi) and the like.
Title: Re: All right now who do ya want in Smash Bros. 4
Post by: KoopaTrooper on June 04, 2013, 08:35:42 AM
It'll be either Zoroark or Gen VI's equivalent, sadly.

Yup. Nintendo sadly doesn't care about the community, just like every other game developer. They want you to like only the Pokemon that they want you to like so they could use it for advertising.  One question I have for them is why they didn't include a Machamp back in Melee when the 1st and 2nd generations were popular. He would seem like the perfect character for a fighting game, not Mewtwo.
Title: Re: All right now who do ya want in Smash Bros. 4
Post by: The Chef on June 04, 2013, 09:43:51 AM
Because Machamp wasn't the subject of the first two Pokémon movies?
Title: Re: All right now who do ya want in Smash Bros. 4
Post by: Weegee on June 04, 2013, 12:46:36 PM
Putting Machamp in Mewtwo's place would be like including Wart rather than Bowser.
Title: Re: All right now who do ya want in Smash Bros. 4
Post by: The Chef on June 04, 2013, 02:55:05 PM
I equate it more to putting a Boom Boom or a Hammer Bro there instead of Bowser.
Title: Re: All right now who do ya want in Smash Bros. 4
Post by: Weegee on June 04, 2013, 03:22:34 PM
You're right. That was just the first thing that came to mind.

I still think a generic Animal Crossing human would be good.
Title: Re: All right now who do ya want in Smash Bros. 4
Post by: KoopaTrooper on June 04, 2013, 04:44:33 PM
The problem is that Pokémon simply doesn't fit in any format besides its own. Picking Zoroark or any other 'Mon would be picking favorites. Adding all the Pokémon would ruin the game. Then it would just be "Pokémon brawl" and not "Nintendo Brawl". I think Pokémon should still be items, but characters is just plain stupid.
Title: Re: All right now who do ya want in Smash Bros. 4
Post by: Bigluigifan1.0 on June 04, 2013, 08:28:11 PM
I wouldn't mind current starters (upcoming Gen 6, that is) + Pikachu. Actually, the Trainer was a great way to break in several of them without clogging up the game.
Title: Re: All right now who do ya want in Smash Bros. 4
Post by: The Chef on June 05, 2013, 12:32:58 AM
The problem is that Pokémon simply doesn't fit in any format besides its own. Picking Zoroark or any other 'Mon would be picking favorites. Adding all the Pokémon would ruin the game. Then it would just be "Pokémon brawl" and not "Nintendo Brawl". I think Pokémon should still be items, but characters is just plain stupid.

Yeah, putting characters from a game about monsters that fight each other in a fighting game is such a stupid idea.
Title: Re: All right now who do ya want in Smash Bros. 4
Post by: Godot on June 05, 2013, 12:53:21 AM
Putting notably different 'mons like MewTwo worked, since he could talk and engage in pugilism with Ganondorf without distress. Jigglypuff is absurd enough to be fine, Pikachu is too iconic not to be in the game. Pokémon Trainer worked since he represented something greater than just a 'mon. Lucario seemed a little strange, but works fine I guess.

If they put like, a Garbador as a playable character, that's where I take issue with it. Now it just seems out of place. And not in the comical Jigglypuff way either, since (s)he's been permanently grandfathered into the series by virtue of being in the first one.
Title: Re: All right now who do ya want in Smash Bros. 4
Post by: The Chef on June 05, 2013, 09:46:10 AM
Part of the reason Mewtwo and Lucario got in is because they were important enough to have their own movies. Both of them were given the voices, personality and extra abilities they had in said movies.
Title: Re: All right now who do ya want in Smash Bros. 4
Post by: KoopaTrooper on June 05, 2013, 01:47:58 PM
Also they both look like humans, so it was easy to develop a move set.
Title: Re: All right now who do ya want in Smash Bros. 4
Post by: The Chef on June 05, 2013, 05:16:43 PM
Yeah because developing a moveset for Kirby and Jigglypuff was so difficult.
Title: Re: All right now who do ya want in Smash Bros. 4
Post by: Tavros on June 06, 2013, 07:58:09 AM
Oh man Brawl came out in 2008 because of Pikachu's moveset.