Fungi Forums
Video Games => Mario Chat => Topic started by: Sup-edMad-io on July 18, 2005, 06:17:33 PM
-
There comes a time in series when you get tired of the same old junk. Well, I happen to be the tired of the same old "Bowser kidnaps Peach and Mario rescues her" plot. I thought that Super Mario Sunshine would be a departure from that, but unfortunately, Shadow Mario turned out to be Bowser Jr., Bowser's son through Peach. The whole idea is really starting to turn stale. Besides, Bowser isn't as evil or threatening as he used to be, he's just an immature creep. And he's helped Mario and Luigi too many times (e.g. Super Mario RPG and Mario and Luigi: Superstar Saga). I think it's time for Bowser to end his villain reign and become the Super Mario Brothers' friends, like Wario, Waluigi and Donkey Kong have. He can still sometimes be mean, like the first two are sometimes, but I would like to see him as a playable character in the Mario Party games.
He should just end this thing with Peach and find a Monstrous Koopa (that's what I call the kind of Koopa he is) lady to be in love with, someone that even Bowser Jr. will like.
And Nintendo's going to need to find a new villain, just like they did with Bowser after Donkey Kong. It's a good thing they didn't overuse Donkey Kong, or Wario, as much as they did with Bowser. Like I said, I think it's time for Bowser to move on from his villain days. His stance has become too stale. Maybe the Mushroom Kingdom and the Koopa Kingdom can unite together to keep peace in the Mushroom World. How many of you are for ending Bowser's reign as a villain. Let me know here and maybe we could start a movement for it on the web.
"Eet's-a Mad-io not-a Ma-dio"
-
Peach isn't Bowser Jr.'s mother. Bowser lied to his son.
-
Bowser a good guy!? No way! Just cause they have worked together doesn't mean they're pals. The two had to combine forces to take out a greater threat! Then they just go back to trying to kill each other. In SMRPG, Bowser fought Mario at the very end, even though they were friends for the whole game. This goes for Dr. Eggman in Sonic the Hedgehog as well. The bottom line: They only worked together to take out a greater force. And the story line isn't always the same. In Mario spin off titles, Bowser is sometimes a playable character. I think it's all good.
"Rockin Robots, Dr. Light!"~Megaman
-
Forget it. Bowser will never be a permanent good guy. Yes he isn't as menacing as he used to be but being a good guy would completly ruin his character. It's a constant conflict of good vs evil with Mario and Bowser at both ends.
Kelso: Guys this is a game of Cat & Mouse between me & Hyde. I''m gonna make him admit he''s been going out with Jackie behind my back.
Fez: Guys, what happens in Cat & Mouse if the cat is retarded?
-
yes, now that I think about it Super Mario Sunshine was a pretty bad game.
___________________________
I am the best person in existance!
-
I think bowser was born when Godzilla and one of the Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles had a baby. How could they have a baby? Godzilla can reproduce by himself (herself?).
Well, this is where the signature goes...
-
I like Bowser. I like him as an enemy. I wouldn't mind if they made some game like "Super Bowser Koopa", which followed up after Nintendo's big hit "Super Peach Princess", which followed up after Nintendo's big hit "Super Mario Bros".
Ninja Turtles rock!
Mushrooms, amalgamate!
-
Mr. Wiggles, at what point did you forget that Wario and Donkey Kong became good guys and that didn't ruin their characters (they were once evil like Bowser (maybe D.K. was just insane in the original Donkey Kong, but Wario defintely evil in Super Mario Land 2: 6 Golden Coins), so why should it ruin Bowser's character? He's not really that evil anymore. He's just a moronic jerk who needs to learn that Mushroomian humans don't mix with Monstrous Koopas. The whole Mario vs. Bowser thing has defintely become stale, and so has the kindapping Peach thing. If Bowser shouldn't be a good guy, then he should defintely find another Monstrous Koopa to fall in love with. I'm tired of the same old junk over and over again, you should all be too. If you think it would ruin his character, then how bout just making Bowser a playable character in the Mario Party games. It's like him being a playable character in Mario Kart, Golf and Tennis. It's like Austin Powers. They recycled a lot of jokes from the first movie and even did more in the third movie. Every series has to change every now and then. Bowser's now just and idiot, like Jessie and James of Team Rocket in the Pokemon TV show. I'm sure their stance has become stale too. The Super Mario series needs a new recurring villain and a new conflict. Maybe Bowser doesn't have to be a permanent good guy, but like I said, every series need to change every now and then.
One more thing. Bowser should be called "Loser" not "Bowser." He is a loser and no a single bit of a threat that he used to be. I know none of you would agree with me, but I'm still trying to make a point.
"Eet's-a Mad-io not-a Ma-dio"
-
Once I realized that Bowser was really the bad guy in Super Mario Sunshine, the gameplay started sucking.</sarcasm>
Mushrooms, amalgamate!
-
Here let me put it on the map for you:
Mario = Protaganist
Bowser = Antaginast
Ever since SMB was developed this is how it has been since. Removing Bowser as life long villain would be just as bad as removing the main villain from any other series. Do you really think people actually care whether Bowser is stale or not? Most of the people who play Mario games do it for fun, not for a complex story or deep characters. Take into account that Mario and Luigi have been the main heroes for years, yet we don't even really know a lot about them. Has it been a huge blow to sales? No.
And your whole idea about replacing Bowser with a new villain is pointless. Every now and then we have a new main villain for the game that forces Bowser to sit this one out. If you need any more proof let me list them for you:
Wart: Well this one was actually just a dream Mario had but no mention or appearence by Bowser whatsoever.
Smitty: Dude takes over Bowser's castle and wreaks havoc all over the land. This is one of the times Mario and Bowser are forced to team up.
Tetanga: Pseudo-Bowser invading Sarasaland. Another no show from Bowser.
Cackletta: Steals Peach's voice to take over neighboring kingdom. The only other time Mario and Bowser have to team up. Bowser does reoccer through the game but has amnesia so he doesn't remember squat till halfway through the game and even then he has his body taken over.
Grodus: No need for an explanation.
So basically no new villain is needed and Bowser isn't going to join to good side just because he isn't a serious villain. He's still a considerable threat to the Mushroom Kingdom since he has his legion of followers and all that weaponry.
Kelso: Guys this is a game of Cat & Mouse between me & Hyde. I''m gonna make him admit he''s been going out with Jackie behind my back.
Fez: Guys, what happens in Cat & Mouse if the cat is retarded?
-
Why don't people follow the DKC plot.The DK we know today is the Grandson of the origional
YOSHIS RULE
-
Because that plot is stupid. Why did they have to turn the original DK, a great antagonist, into a cranky old coot? It could've easily worked without all of that "monkeying" around with the storyline.
"It's impossible this way!"
-
no I think that Mario should go out and buy gun and go kill Bowser.This would the end same old Mario vs. Bowser storyline forever(unless somehow bowser came back to life).
riiiigggghhhhtttt...
-
So what if it's always Bowser all the...wait, most of the time? His folied attempts never get old (especially, since I think his IQ drops every game). It's one of those mutual(?) hero/villain relationship that is meant to last for all eternity.
-
Bowser is a way bigger enemy than Wario and DK ( despite the fact Cranky Kong was in the first Mario game as his first enemy ).With all the games with Bowser causing mayhem it's really way too later for him just walk to Mario and say,"I'm sorry.Let's forget our long history of our hatred to each other and start fresh." People are used to Bowser as the enemy and would be outraged if any of that changed.(I grew up fighting him as the final boss on my SNES.)If you dont like the fact Bowser is always being the villian than maybe playing Mario games less could solve that.Dont take this wrong,I sometimes get bored of the idea too,but I'm used to it.I mean,if they had a new permament enemy to take Bowser's place it'll be like starting from the beginning (by that I mean Super Mario Bros,not Donkey Kong )and the years of history of Mario and Bowser's rivalry will be broken with a probable Bowser wannabe.Although,if you're really interested on old ideas changing in the Mario Universe try playing Super Princess Peach when it is out on stores.It has been known the game will change her 'damsel in destress' reputation and hopefully grant her a reasonable amount of respect from everyone.If you would rather not play Super Princess Peach,then you wont be seeing anything new in a long time,most likely.
" I would suggest that it''s not the medium, but the quality of perception and expression, that determines the significance of art." ~Bill Watterson
Edited by - PaperMario on 8/9/2005 11:43:25 PM
-
I tried making a topic like this when I first came the TMK. But, I've realized that even though Bowser is the bad guy in a lot of the games, and even though MArio beats him every time, to me it never gets old. Why doesn't it ever get old...I have no idea. But the thing is, Jessie and James on Poke'mon got REALLY REALLY REALLY old and annoying. Why? Because they were featured in every single poke'mon show and lost every battle. They're just like a stupid side note that lets you hear them proclaim to everyone that they're blasting off again, and allows you to see pikachu just...shock them. Howver, with Mario the bad gus change every once in a while, and Bowser is not just a side note, but a WHOLE note...(right?) He's the main idea in the game. You have to work hard and go through fun levels to get to him (not befriend a pokemon and then yell "OMG! TEAM ROCKET!" at the end of the show just for the heck of it)...Alright that's all.
“A wagon full of pamcakes? In the Champeen ship?! I’d like to see ya try!†~ Homestar Runner
-
I agree Blue Toad. Every darn episode went like this: Ash and friends are on a road. They meet some guy with a new Pokemon. Pikachu battles. Team Rocket fights to steal them both. They fail, and Pikachu zaps them. They blast off. Ash says goodbye to the guy. To be continued. It got old. But Bowser had new tricks every game. The only time I hated him was in Mario Party. But the big lug won't be backing down anytime soon.
"You fools! You''ve messed with the natural ordaaaaaaa!!!"~ The story telling crow from the Grim Adventures of Billy and Mandy.
-
There was once a more recent episode about Charizard that made me feel sad. After Charizard was supposed to be this ultra mega pokemon that was so powerful he was lazy about it, but then when they visit all the other Charizards, he's a weakling and it was sad. Then he gets to stay and train though, so it's not that bad.
Even if Bowser isn't the villian in a game, I don't see any rush for him to be friendly.
“Of all the people I know, it is expected that Watoad will say ‘cheese’ first.â€
-
Mr. Wiggles: Who the dukar is Smitty?! Just kidding.
Personally I would like to see some old villains return in some game and maybe team up. I can see Wart playing in Mario Baseball (as odd as it would be to see a fat frog running down bases), and you could have a statue of Smity in some castle just to freak people out when they walk by. But mostly I'd like to see a game that had a picture gallery of all of Mario's enemies from the past just for fun. Okay, I'm done with that now.
I'm not really tired of Bowser but I do think he's not as scary as he used to be (except in Melee of course). I remember how much he scared me in SMB, not his look but just how he would never take his eyes off you and shot fire at you like crazy. And in SM64 how he kept walking towards you nonstop, sometimes even running and leaping at you! Bowser should be a little harder in some games and definitely look scarier like Giga Bowser does. He could find some powerful item that transforms him into a giant monser (Bowserilla?) and makes little girls scream and run away from the game. Heh heh heh!
And one more thing... I disagree that SMS is a bad game, but it could have been a ton better. I liked using FLUDD and riding Yoshi in it, and especially the roller coaster ride. I hated the unbalance of too easy/ too hard challenges, lack of camera angles, and more things to do besides the same stuff. But I enjoyed it for the most part. Especially the manta ghost boss!
And let us not be weary in well doing: for in due season we shall reap, if we faint not.
Edited by - Yoshisaurus Rex on 8/10/2005 6:53:23 PM
-
I truly think SMS was the sequal to SM64. That's my opinion, and not even SM128 can change that. Although I'm gonna hurt someone if it doesn't come out soon.
-
I agree with Blue T. too.I'm SO sick of Team Rocket!!!!!!!!! They could at least TRY to make a decent episode once in a while without them.But they just throw them in and mark it as something new.I'm glad Nintendo uses diffferent enemies every once in a while for Mario.If that cant keep everyone satisfied, then I suggest they move on.
" I would suggest that it''s not the medium, but the quality of perception and expression, that determines the significance of art." ~Bill Watterson,a true role model.
Edited by - PaperMario on 8/11/2005 6:31:32 PM
-
Yes let's set aside the fact that the quality has gone up since the removal of Misty and the change of setting....
Kelso: Guys this is a game of Cat & Mouse between me & Hyde. I''m gonna make him admit he''s been going out with Jackie behind my back.
Fez: Guys, what happens in Cat & Mouse if the cat is retarded?
-
Man,I hated Misty.
" I would suggest that it''s not the medium, but the quality of perception and expression, that determines the significance of art." ~Bill Watterson,a true role model.
-
Misty made Pokémon. It isn't the same without her.
-
Of course it isn't the same without her.
It's much better.
Kelso: Guys this is a game of Cat & Mouse between me & Hyde. I''m gonna make him admit he''s been going out with Jackie behind my back.
Fez: Guys, what happens in Cat & Mouse if the cat is retarded?
-
Actually, I miss Misty. She's ten times better then this new girl and annoying little kid. Why can't they just get rid of Brock??? They keep making him come back.
“A wagon full of pamcakes? In the Champeen ship?! I’d like to see ya try!†~ Homestar Runner
-
This post is quoting what Sup-ed Mad-io said about Bowser being a loser.
Bowser DOES pose a threat. Have you tried fighting him in Paper Marii: The Thousand-Year Door?
He doesn't always kidnap Peach, either. Or, whenever he does, he manages to do something else.
For example, take a look at Paper Mario for the N64; yes, he kidnapped Peach, but he also stole the Star Rod and planned to use it to grant evil wishes against the star kids. That idea isn't stale, is it? As far as I'm concerned, that plot has never been used before in a Mario game.
Paper Mario 2's story does include Bowser. but, he does not kidnap Peach; he just tries to take the crystal stars, and fails.
And Bowser is a playable character in many games. You can be him in the Mario Kart series, SSBM, Paper Mario: The Thousand-Year Door, and I think in Toadstool Tour.
Below are the only games in which Bowser poses as a villain that kidnaps Peach:
Super Mario Bros, Super Mario Bros 3, Super Mario World, Super Mario 64 (and DS version), Sunshine, and Paper Mario.
I think about it, that's not really a lot of games that Bowser kidnaps Peach in.
-
Couldn't have put it better myself. I thought in Paper Mario: The Thousand Year Door, Bowser was more like a comic relief kinda guy. He was just humorous in that game.
“A wagon full of pamcakes? In the Champeen ship?! I’d like to see ya try!†~ Homestar Runner
-
Actually, I miss Misty. She's ten times better then this new girl
Wait wait wait hold on a second...
Did you just say that with a straight face?
*Bursts out laughing and explodes*
Kelso: Guys this is a game of Cat & Mouse between me & Hyde. I''m gonna make him admit he''s been going out with Jackie behind my back.
Fez: Guys, what happens in Cat & Mouse if the cat is retarded?
-
I really liked how the Mario RPG's worked everything out. For once Peach wasn't a damsel in distress but actually a good female archatype, fighting alongside the heroes and using her brain powers to aid Mario. Though she did have some blond moments once in a while (read my sig.). Then there are the Mario RPG Series original villains. Smithy was the first REAL evil in the Mario games and he hid in a giant sword. Then I liked how they had female villains which is very astute since females in Mario's world are portrayed as innocent and in danger. Sure Cackletta was annoying...but *spoilers* Shadow Queen! OMG, she was awesome. The whole ending to TYD was a hard left turn from the Mario series. And it was just flat out cool with evil Peach. *end spoilers* Mario does need some new villains other than Bowser, but that isn't to say Bowser has lost his villain luster either, its just that variety is good.
-
Yeah, I think Mario RPGs are the more creative Mario games. They have better sotries than the platformers, and really get you hooked on the game, having to know what happens next. I also liked how in PM:TTYD you got to know more about your partners, not just "They join you, so there". bobbery, would be a great example. And yes, even though Bowser is the main villain in quite a few of the Mario games, he always has something new up his sleeve, and still gives you that "I just beat a Mario game w00t" feeling.
“A wagon full of pamcakes? In the Champeen ship?! I’d like to see ya try!†~ Homestar Runner