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Author Topic: Mariology (serious posts wanted)  (Read 476286 times)

« Reply #1380 on: October 09, 2007, 05:55:57 PM »
Incidentally, I've heard World 2 of SMB3 referred to as the Koophari Desert before. Does anyone know the origins of that?

It came from early copies of SMB3 for the NES having different location names in the credits (there's a page on TMK somewhere about the differences. I'll find it unless someone else finds it first..)

It was also in the movie, but as the movie came about in 1993, and SMB3 came in.. 1989? (I forget what year). Also, the SMB3 cartoon called it the Koopahari.

What I want to know is where do the tracks from Mario Kart games fit in? (ie: Kalimari Desert? Royal Raceway? Mario Circuit [NGC]?) Most of the tracks within the MK games are inconsistant with themselves, so it would be hard to add them to any sort of map.

And the stadiums/golf courses in the Tennis/Golf games (and the locations in Mario Baseball)..
Kinopio is the ultimate video game character! Who else can drive a kart, host parties, play tennis, give good advice and items, and is almost always happy??

Chupperson Weird

  • Not interested.
« Reply #1381 on: October 09, 2007, 10:35:36 PM »
That is incorrect. The original version of SMB3 calls it Desert Hill (see also: MKDS), and the second version of SMB3 calls it Desert Land. Never is it referred to as the Koopahari Desert.
That was a joke.

CrossEyed7

  • i can make this whatever i want; you're not my dad
« Reply #1382 on: October 09, 2007, 10:47:48 PM »
From what I've seen of SML2, its exclusivity doesn't seem to be much more extreme than most other Mario games, though I am basing this off of SMWiki articles rather than playing the game (though I might get a chance to soon; a friend of mine has a copy at home, the only problem will be actually playing it, since all I have with me is a DS.).

As for Mario Kart tracks, which are pretty much the only thing I can comment on here, as I haven't yet played Power Tennis or Superstar Baseball, I get the feeling that most of them aren't permanent - especially the one around Peach's castle, which changes every year, and happened to not be visible in pretty much any game that features the castle. A bit wasteful for them, but it makes my job easier. However, I would like to try to mark the "previous" locations of most tracks on the final map.

Also, after getting sidetracked on SMWiki several times, I really want to play Super Princess Peach. Which reminds me, I should probably move Vibe Island closer to Dinosaur World, considering it has so many SMW enemies.
"Oh man, I wish being a part of a Mario fan community was the most embarrassing thing about my life." - Super-Jesse

MaxVance

  • Vance Vance Revolution
« Reply #1383 on: October 10, 2007, 05:24:43 AM »
The Super Mario Wiki allows speculation. Which means that the information that wasn't revealed in the games themselves was made up by people like you.
Remember that your first Goomba boldly you walk? When Mario touched that mushroom being brought up more largely remember that you are surprised? Miscalculate your jump that pit remember that it falls?

« Reply #1384 on: October 11, 2007, 05:05:45 PM »
That is incorrect. The original version of SMB3 calls it Desert Hill (see also: MKDS), and the second version of SMB3 calls it Desert Land. Never is it referred to as the Koopahari Desert.

I was sure I saw some game text reffering it to the Koopahari..

I just thought of something else too: locations in the Mario Party games. Do you really think they are in a different world (as MP6 would have you believe) or do you think they are just in the Mario world that we already know and love?
Kinopio is the ultimate video game character! Who else can drive a kart, host parties, play tennis, give good advice and items, and is almost always happy??

Reading

  • is FUNdamental
« Reply #1385 on: October 11, 2007, 06:39:24 PM »
I was sure I saw some game text reffering it to the Koopahari..

I just thought of something else too: locations in the Mario Party games. Do you really think they are in a different world (as MP6 would have you believe) or do you think they are just in the Mario world that we already know and love?

The only reference (as far as I remember) to World 2 in the in-game SMB3 text is when Peach mentions the "sand dunes" in a letter. Also, the SMA4 guide I have refers to it as the Koopahari only once, and not even in the World 2 section, so I think "Koopahari" was something created later (There's also a Japanese-only SMA4 e-Reader level called "Koopahari Desert" that we were unfortunately deprived of along with the rest...not exactly sure if this has a meaning for the issue, though. Speaking of which, are those e-Reader levels real places, that is, canon?).

Hmm, the Mario Party games...well, I guess we could say that they're the deserts, grasslands, etc. from all the Mario games, but...with spaces all over them? The general concept of the "board game" style leads me to believe that they're some kind of simulated environments, or possibly, like you said, in another world (perhaps there's a Mario Party dimension they travel to whenever they want to have a party? That would make a great idea for my website fan-fiction...).
We went to see them for the first time in 5 years because they were going away for 3 years.

Chupperson Weird

  • Not interested.
« Reply #1386 on: October 11, 2007, 09:10:03 PM »
There is no canon. So of course they are.
That was a joke.

Reading

  • is FUNdamental
« Reply #1387 on: October 12, 2007, 04:22:54 PM »
There's a few things going on in Mario games, like Bowser presumably dying after Paper Mario and then being revived by King Boo as mentioned by the fortune teller in Luigi's Mansion, or FLUDD mentioning "a strange old man in a white coat" or E. Gadd in Partners in Time saying he'll move his lab to Boo Woods, that seem to imply some kind of continuity, even if it is a very loose one. I guess everyone can decide for themselves if there's a Mario canon or not.

Hey, I just got an idea for a thread.
We went to see them for the first time in 5 years because they were going away for 3 years.

CrossEyed7

  • i can make this whatever i want; you're not my dad
« Reply #1388 on: October 13, 2007, 11:18:04 PM »
All right, here's my new map. This should cover pretty much the entire planet.



Sarasaland is pretty straightfoward, though I am a little proud of the little themed pictures I added to the areas, which you can't make out at this size. If anyone cares, I could upload a close-up of it, or pretty much any other place on the map.

The northern Mushroom Kingdom continent is mostly the same, but there are some notable changes. First, I've decided for the time being that Star Hill from SMRPG and Shooting Star Summit from PM are different places. Not as simple and clean as I'd like, but it'll have to do for now. I've added the Koopahari Desert as a desert connected to Dry Dry Desert, right outside Mushroom City, which, admittedly, was inspired by the Mario movie. I decided to make a compromise between conflicting sources of dubious canonicity. The two deserts are connected by Shifting Sand Land. Hollijolli Village is at the very north of the continent, and Flower Fields is isolated in the northwest. Also, World 6 has reverted to the name Iced Land, as I have recently realized that Sherbet Land is actually on Kitchen Island. Finally, Gusty Gulch is around the border between Dry Dry Desert and the rest of the continent.

The southern continent has Gritzy Desert, because I figured the north one had enough desert land already. It's also had the Beanbean Kingdom transplanted onto the bottom of it, and the areas from the Donkey Kong Country games are nearby.

Jewelry Land is represented as accurately as I can until Yoshi's Safari comes to the virtual console. In addition to adding Diamond City to it, I also added the areas from Wario World, as well as Kitchen Island from Wario Land 1. I don't know where Wario Land II is supposed to be set, but Wario Land 3 is inside a bunch of toyboxes, so that doesn't need to be added. As for Warioland 4, I've decided for now that the levels aren't real, though there's probably plenty of space to add them someday, and the Golden Pyramid is to the southwest of the Wario World areas, inside Dino Dino Jungle from Double Dash. My theory was that the pyramid had some kind of time seal on it, keeping the Golden Diva, Shokora, and the bosses perfectly preserved for however long, and the seal leaked into the surrounding area, and so dinosaurs were still around. Kind of stupid, I know. Anyway, I like how Kitchen Island turned out, but I think I made it way too big. And I also made Vibe Island (which I placed near Dinosaur Land, since it has so many SMW enemies) too small -- it ought to be at least as big as Yoshi's Island. Size wasn't really a major issue when I was making this map.

Don't pay any major attention to the Waffle Kingdom sites; I realized, after I inked everything in, that Luigi gave compass directions for most of the locations. The ones I've been able to reread so far have coincidentally been moderately close to the right places, but they'll need some major revision the next time I revisit the map (For example, I placed the Rapturous Ruins on the Strudel Continent, but they're actually supposed to be "beyond the northernmost sea.").

The main thing on my mind right now is whether Shooting Star Summit and Stardust Fields should be merged, which would drastically change some layouts. I decided not to think about it too hard yet, especially since we'll probably get some shots of the Mushroom Planet in Mario Galaxy, which may solve some of our problems. Also, I know I forgot to add some places, including Thwomp Volcano and Lavalava Island. As always, I'm very open to any comments, criticisms, or praises.
« Last Edit: October 13, 2007, 11:20:16 PM by CrossEyed7 »
"Oh man, I wish being a part of a Mario fan community was the most embarrassing thing about my life." - Super-Jesse

« Reply #1389 on: October 15, 2007, 03:05:24 PM »
I just want to say that my map will be up tomorrow. What i did was actually put a lot of the locations from SMRPG near the Mushroom-Bean-Bean Border. You'll see tomorrow.
OH, NO! There goes Tokyo! GO, GO GODZILLA!
------
Yinzers Rule!

Reading

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« Reply #1390 on: October 15, 2007, 04:55:08 PM »
If anyone cares, I could upload a close-up of it, or pretty much any other place on the map.

There's a lot of places on that map whose names are too small to read at this size...those islands to the right of the South Mushroom Kingdom/Beanbean Kingdom, and the Wario World places as well as that orange place on the S. Mushroom Kingdom continent. Could you say what they are? (Also, is that island to the west of Giant Land anything?) I don't think Shooting Star Summit and Stardust Fields should be merged; Stardust Fields is to the south, shared with the Beanbean Kingdom, and SSS is north of Peach's Castle, so it's unlikely they're close together.

I'm starting to work on my own map like I said, and I've made a list of all the places from the following Mario games: SMB, tLL, SMB3, SMW, SMW2, SMRPG, PM, SMS (Isle Delfino), M&L SS, PM: tTYD, and M&L PiT. I've also included "miscellaneous" locations, which are Sarasaland, Kitchen Island, the Waffle Kingdom, Luigi's Mansion/Boo Woods, Vibe Island, and Jewelry Land/Diamond City. Since I've almost never played any Wario games, I've put down Wario World as well but didn't include any locations, since the places from Wario games don't have much signifigance in anything I'm using the map for. Did I miss anything else?
We went to see them for the first time in 5 years because they were going away for 3 years.

CrossEyed7

  • i can make this whatever i want; you're not my dad
« Reply #1391 on: October 15, 2007, 05:31:32 PM »
The light blue island is Joke's End, the one below it is Oho Oasis, and the ones to the northeast of it, between it and Dinosaur Land, are DK Island, Crocodile Island (former site; it sunk at the end of the game, IIRC), and the Northern Kremisphere, from DKC 1, 2, and 3 respectively. The island to the west of Giant Land isn't labeled, but it could be the island world from NSMB. The tiny dot to the immediate east of Giant Land is Tiny-Huge Island. The orange spot in the S. Mushroom Kingdom is Gritzy Desert, since I figured I'd already put enough desert on the north.

I don't recall whether compass directions were ever given in PM. M&L had several overworld locations named by their compass directions, such as "NW Beanbean," but I don't know whether any other game, other than Luigi's recaps of his adventures in TTYD, gave labeled compass directions. The main reason I've decided SSS and SDF should be separate is because if they're connected, the Beanbean Kingdom seems far too close to Toad Town to require the Koopa Cruiser to get there.

Here's an album with all the close-up shots I took so far: http://messiah.facebook.com/album.php?aid=2032044&l=efaee&id=55303319
"Oh man, I wish being a part of a Mario fan community was the most embarrassing thing about my life." - Super-Jesse

« Reply #1392 on: October 16, 2007, 04:03:31 PM »
Here's My Map.(cities/small regions in numbers, large regions in letters)

Key:1.Toadtown, 2.Bean-Bean Town, 3.Rogueport, 4.Yoshi's Island, 5.Delfino Isle, 6.Nimbus Kingdom, 7.Goomba Village, 8.Shooting Star Summit, 9. Dry-Dry Outpost, 10.Boo Mansion, 11.Gusty Gulch, 12.Tadpole Pond, 13.Rosetown, 14.Moleville, 15.Joke's End, 16.Shiver City, 17.Koopa Village, 18.Little Fungitown, 19.Booster Tower, 20.Luigi's Mansion, 21.Lavalava Island, 22.Petalburg, 23.The Great Tree, 24.Fahr Outpost, 25.Twilight Town, 26.Poshley Heights, 27.Keelhaul Key, 28.Monstrotown, 29.Thwomp Volcano,
30.Hollijolli Village, 31.Diamond City, 32.Marrymore, 33.Seaside Town, 34.Bowser's Castle.
Regions: (Note Bean-Bean, Koopa, Co-owned Mushroom/Beanbean)
A.Mushroom Major, B.Boo Woods, C.Dry-Dry Desert, D.Yoshi Islands, E.Koopa Kingdom, F.Bean-Bean Kingdom, G.Shiver Region, H.Toadwood Forest, I.TeeHee Valley, J.Stardust Fields, K.Chucklehuck Woods, L.Boggly Woods, M.Petal Meadows, N.Mushroom Minor, O.Hoohoroo Mountain, P.Bean Valley, Q.Gwarhar Lagoon
OH, NO! There goes Tokyo! GO, GO GODZILLA!
------
Yinzers Rule!

« Reply #1393 on: October 16, 2007, 04:52:57 PM »
Here's a geographical map of what it would look like from above.
OH, NO! There goes Tokyo! GO, GO GODZILLA!
------
Yinzers Rule!

CrossEyed7

  • i can make this whatever i want; you're not my dad
« Reply #1394 on: October 16, 2007, 07:55:18 PM »
So you combined Forever Forest and Boo Woods? Interesting.

I think you probably did a better job of combining SMRPG and PM than I did. The only problem I have with it is that I had always pictured Nimbus Land being closer to Bowser's Castle, partly to make the bus a more obvious solution, and partly because Barrel Volcano seems like it fits better in Bowser-type land.

Have you put much thought yet into how to make it work with the SMA4 map? It's a great map on its own, but without a Grass Land above (in some direction) a desert, an ice land above (same direction) both of them, and Dark Land to the right of up, it doesn't mesh with "canon."

Were you planning on including the other islands in SMW around Yoshi's Island, or just leaving them implied?

Also, maybe this is just hammerspace-type stuff, but the Beanbean Kingdom seems too close to Toad Town for Mario and Luigi to have to fly there, when Mario regularly covered, by this map, twice that distance by foot in SMRPG.
"Oh man, I wish being a part of a Mario fan community was the most embarrassing thing about my life." - Super-Jesse

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