Author Topic: Religion (Read 70968 times)

Luigison · « **Reply #210 on:** June 04, 2003, 07:43:34 PM »

Lizard Dude: "Why do some people have no faith in some fairly logical research and infinite faith in a Book?"

Sapphira: "Because NOTHING in that Book can be proven WRONG. Almost EVERYTHING in it has BEEN PROVEN TRUE. Logic would conclude that the rest is true, too."

Luigison: Actually some things have been shown to be incorrect because of the lack of understanding of its writers. These small things don't have to do with it main concepts and can be ignored anyway. For example, we KNOW now that the Earth orbits the sun, but the Bible suggests it's the other way around because that was the believe at the time. Even knowing this today many people (I am not using the Bible's 'races' definition) still say that the sun rises, but really it is the Earth rotation that makes it look that way.

Also, be careful not to take all of the trueths of the Bible to far. Hitler used the logic in the Bible to ustify what he did to the Jews.

http://www.superiorbooks.com/excerpts/why_exc.pdf

Sapphira, you may want to add to the discussion at http://www.mwillett.org/atheism/funny.htm

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Random Signature:
"You can't keep blaming yourself. Just blame yourself once, and move on."

Sapphira · « **Reply #211 on:** June 04, 2003, 07:58:07 PM »

...Uh...huuuh... okaaaay...
Name something SPECIFICALLY untrue about the Bible. And honestly, the "sun rising"? for crying out loud, we still say that today. I've read the Bible the WHOLE WAY THROUGH, and never ONCE did it refer to anything untrue. It's obvious no one can prove me wrong unless they, themselves, have ALSO read the Bible.

*Shakes head* How can you disagree with something you're not even familiar with?

--------------------
Deep inside us all is a little green elf telling us to burn things.

Lizard Dude · « **Reply #212 on:** June 05, 2003, 11:14:36 AM »

Whoa, Sapphira. When did I say things in the Bible were untrue? And what have you *proven* false about evolution?

I know what you're talking about, Luigison. The Bible says pi equals three. Heh.

â€œIâ€™m a stupid fatty and I love to play with my Easy Bake oven!â€

Sapphira · « **Reply #213 on:** June 05, 2003, 11:34:46 AM »

...Heheheh...sorry...I can get defensive sometimes. And I like I said, I'm most passionate about stuff I believe in.

So far, evolution has neither been *proven* right or wrong. It's just a theory.

You could say the Bible is just a "theory" too, but some things *HAVE* been proven true. Nothing so far has been proven untrue, so as I said, it's logical to assume the rest of it's true.
While stating that, if the Bible *IS*, in fact, true, then the theory of evolution would be proven flawed.

This is why I put my faith in this "Book"--because not only does it make sense to me and explain a lot of questions, but a lot of it *ACTUALLY* is *proven* true, and nothing untrue. So naturally I put my faith in something I can trust.

--------------------
Deep inside us all is a little green elf telling us to burn things.

Luigison · « **Reply #214 on:** June 05, 2003, 06:57:57 PM »

Although some things that happened in the Bible can be shown to possible happen in other ways, that doesn't mean that they couldn't happen the way the Bible says. For example, certain dessert bushes have layers of oily wax on their leaves and stems that protect them from dehydrating in the harsh dessert sun. These plants have been seen to get so hot that their waxy layer catches fire. Now, that doesn't prove that God didn't use a bush as stated in the Bible. So, you are correct as far as I know in saying that nothing in the Bible has been proven wrong.

You said, "Nothing so far has been proven untrue, so as I said, it's logical to assume the rest of it's true."

I don't disagree with you that things in the bible have not been proven untrue, but I don't think it is logical to assume the rest is true. If I told you some things that you proved were true it wouldn't mean that everything I say is true. I can see your assumption, but you know what they say about when you assume.

You said you have faith in the Bible. Now, that I can respect. Faith and logic to me are different things. Sometimes you have to follow your faith and do things that are not logical. Although, blind faith can also get you killed. You can't jump from a 10-story building and live because of faith. Besides, God said not to test faith that way.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Random Signature:
"'So what do we do if we get bitten by something deadly, then?' He blinked at me as if I was stupid. 'Well what do you think you do?' he said. 'You die of course. That's what deadly means.'"

Insane Steve · « **Reply #215 on:** June 05, 2003, 07:24:16 PM »

Some people follow blind faith; I follow blind logic.

If you want to assume that a whole thing is true because parts of it are true... well... let me prove you wrong.

Suppose you have a bag of marbles. You know nothing about the colors of these marbles, only that they marbles. This bag of marbles represents The Bible, and the marbles themselves represent the stories. (Bear with me here) Now, draw a marble. Let's assume it is green. Draw a second. Another green. A third. Another green. Sapphira, what you are saying is that because the first few marbles you drew are green, the bag is composed of entirely green marbles.

What would happen to that faith if you suddenly drew a red marble?

Ah, the joy of late-night metaphors.

Congratulations! You have just been blessed by the wisdom of Steve.

Black Mage · « **Reply #216 on:** June 05, 2003, 08:34:03 PM »

Both of you are right; one shouldn't assume that all of the stories are true because many of them are.

It works both ways, though. There is still that chance that the rest of the bag is filled with green marbles. Oneâ€™s faith is exactly what may determine what is actually in the bag in the first place, eh?

However, lets say you do draw a red marble after three consecutive green marbles. One had assumed the whole bag consisted of green marbles, but now realizes it is not. However, that isn't necessarily a bad thing. That is, of course, assuming a green marble represents a true story and a red marble an untrue story.

Personally, I believe many of the stories to be untrue in the Bible. By that, I mean that the events did not actually occur. However, I believe these "stories" to be an example for us to follow. Take Adam and Eve, for one. I believe that is a story for us to understand how the earth was created. I don't believe Adam and Eve were both actual living beings. However, that is a lax interpretation of the Bible. I'm not saying what I believe is right, nor am I saying it's wrong.

What I am saying is; so what if you draw a red marble? Even if it's not green, it will still teach you something, which is all the marbles are really supposed to do.

Chupperson Weird · « **Reply #217 on:** June 05, 2003, 08:53:49 PM »

I have something to add that may or may not be of any use.

Anyway, I'm reading The Silmarillion by J.R.R. Tolkien right now. And in the beginning, there's a story of the creation of the Earth. I see it this way - Adam and Eve, or Ainulindalë, they're both interpretations of the beginning. Same goes with a lot of the Bible. I haven't read all of the Bible. But I pretty much think what isn't direct historical accounts is pretty much just interpretations of normal things for that time.

Lizard Dude · « **Reply #218 on:** June 11, 2003, 05:23:47 PM »

Bad news for the alternative multiregional hypothesis today.

See http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&cid=68&ncid=68&e=1&u=/nyt/20030611/ts_nyt/skullsofferfirstglimpseofearlyhumanfaces for details.

â€œIâ€™m a stupid fatty and I love to play with my Easy Bake oven!â€

Black Mage · « **Reply #219 on:** June 11, 2003, 05:45:03 PM »

Quite the blow to the belief we evolved from said Neanderthals.

I've always found it quite interesting when they discover new fossils of things said to be our descendants.

Edited by - Black Mage on 6/11/2003 4:46:37 PM

David · « **Reply #220 on:** June 18, 2003, 02:33:17 AM »

The interesting thing about The Silmarillion and Tolkien is that the basic concept behind all of Tolkien's works support Christianity (he was a Catholic, so that sort of helped). The same with C.S. Lewis and the Narnia books...

Lizard Dude · « **Reply #221 on:** June 19, 2003, 01:55:17 PM »

Like Many Waters, for instance.

â€œIâ€™m a stupid fatty and I love to play with my Easy Bake oven!â€

Marionut#1 · « **Reply #222 on:** June 19, 2003, 04:38:07 PM »

I can point out something thats Translated wrong...it says crap I cant remember where..but it says that your suposed to hate your mother,father,sister,brother,and any other family member you can think of and only love Jesus..however..in the original language, the word they translated to "Hate" Actually means to "love less"..were supposed to love our family less than god...

Itâ€˜s-a me, Marionut#1!

Edited by - Marionut#1 on 6/19/2003 3:38:44 PM

Chupperson Weird · « **Reply #223 on:** June 19, 2003, 06:42:07 PM »

Ugh. The concept behind Many Waters was cool, but the actual book was awful.

Sapphira · « **Reply #224 on:** July 08, 2003, 10:53:21 AM »

Topic revival time! Woooooo! Okay, here's another point I wanted to make on a few posts I saw a while back...

â€œNow about the Mark of Cain, it was been said that it was used as an excuse for the slavery of dark colored skinned people.â€ -- Black Mage

Interesting. I have never thought nor heard about that before. That theory, however, is flawed. Whether or not Cainâ€™s mark was that he was black, weâ€™ll never know. However, had you read your Bible, you would know that none of Cainâ€™s descendents exist anymore. All of the people currently on this planet are descendents of Noah and his sons.

The great flood wiped out EVERYONE on the planet at the time EXCEPT for Noahâ€™s family. So everyone came from them.
Backing up to Noahâ€™s ancestry, he is a descendent of Adam and Eveâ€™s third son whom a name is mentioned (they had a TON more kids): Seth. So, technically, weâ€™re also all descendents of Seth; Cain and Able are out of the picture. Ictso-factso

(Another note: Noah's son's wives could have been of different races...)

--------------------
Deep inside us all is a little green elf telling us to burn things.