Donkey Kong Country Returns

[Mr. Wiggles]

Where the hell were you people back when Jungle Beat shat on the franchise as a whole? Hypocrites...

The difference is, Jungle Beat was never claimed to be a DKC successor.

Not only that, but if you're not flipping your [dukar] over DK's appearances in the Mario sports games, the Mario vs Donkey Kong games, or the Barrel Blast spin-off that nearly reaches post-PS1 era Crash and Spyro quality, then you're being just as hypocritical as you claim CrossEyed is.

Also, David Wise didn't leave Rare until last October. By then, the project would've been too far along to include him as the main composer.

[ShadowBrain]

The DKC games were ugly and frustrating.

[Weegee]

Actually, the graphics were great for their time. If anything, the art/promotional renders were awful.

Your latter point is true, though.

[Turtlekid1]

The collision detection seemed a little off in some parts, I'll admit, but that was mostly due to the characters being pre-rendered and the backgrounds being static.  Or something.

But from what I've played (admittedly I haven't beaten any of them), it's an excellent series.  Even when you consider that I dislike apes.

[The Chef]

The DKC games were ugly and frustrating.

You're ugly and frustrating.

[Captain Jim]

Nice, mature comeback, Chef.

I have to partially agree with Brian for once. The DKC games were eyesores. I don't care about the "revolutionary for its time" thing at all. I thought it was ugly in the 90s, I think it's ugly now. The gameplay and atmosphere were just boring to me though.

However, I must say this game is looking nice visually. Don't know if I'll want to play it still.

[Glitchy]

Am I the only one here that noticed that the new enemies don't exactly look DKCish? I know Rare sort of slipped following DKC2 but still, some of it doesn't really look DCKish.

[ShadowBrain]

Since DK was technically originally a series started by Nintendo, I think it's weird how many people are still clinging to the idea that everything in the series should stick to what Rare came up with. Since Nintendo's Tokyo branch developed Jungle Beat, I'd dare to call that more of a DK game that many others.

[The Chef]

Jungle Beat was as much of a DK game as Kirby's Epic Yarn is a Call of Duty game.

And for the record, this game is an entry in the DKC series, which  Rare created. It's only natural they stick to what Rare established. If this game weren't part of the DKC line it would be understandable, but it is.

[CrossEyed7]

Nintendo did technically create the DK series, in that they made a series of games with "Donkey Kong" in the title, but none of them are really part of the modern DK series. Donkey Kong is a proto-platformer, really part of the Mario series, as a precursor to Mario Bros. (Donkey Kong and Donkey Kong Country have about as much in common as Yoshi's Island and Yoshi's Cookie); Donkey Kong '94 is also part of the Mario series, and, like the Mario vs. Donkey Kong subseries that it's retroactively part of, it's really a puzzle game. Donkey Kong Jr., Donkey Kong Jr. Math, and the two-player mode of the Game & Watch version of Donkey Kong 3 are the only games in the pre-Country, Nintendo-developed DK series where you can play as a Kong, and only DKJr. even slightly resembles what we would now call the DK series (I'm not even gonna bother with Donkey Kong Hockey and the like).

When Rare started the Country series, they created an entire new universe. And the basic elements of that universe, none of which existed before Rare came along -- jungle setting, collectible bananas, other members of the Kong family -- are firmly entrenched enough in the nature of who DK is that they show up in the only non-Rare games in the modern DK series since then: Jungle Beat, Konga, Bongo Blast, and the Clu Clu-alikes (not to mention more than a few allusions in the MvDK series and especially in recent Mario sports titles). For all intents and purposes, Rare created the DK series as we know it today.

[Weegee]

Well said, CrossEyed.

I often wonder why TMK bothers to chronicle the modern Donkey Kong series. Ever since the Rare years, the DK franchise has been just as detached from Mario universe than, say, the Metroid or Kirby series are. The connection between the original rivals is hanging by only a few threads, namely Mario's multiplayer outings and MvsDK.

[Chupperson Weird]

We had a big debate about this when we decided to cover DK games on the site. For whatever reason, we decided that DK games were a subset of Mario.

Chef is really confusing me though. Is it that hard to accept that someone other than Rare made a good game starring Donkey Kong?

[ShadowBrain]

I agree that Rare established the modern image of DK, but it's still ridiculous to assume that nothing should deviate from it.

[The Chef]

Chef is really confusing me though. Is it that hard to accept that someone other than Rare made a good game starring Donkey Kong?

Nah. PAON's King of Swing, Jungle Climber and Barrel Blast are all highly underrated.

[Glitchy]

I agree that Rare established the modern image of DK, but it's still ridiculous to assume that nothing should deviate from it.

Okay, but when you're making a sequel, especially a comeback sequel after like over 10 years, it's supposed to be mostly similar. You're basically saying that it'd be okay if New Super Mario Bros. was a puzzle game. And don't give me this "SUPER MARIO SUNSHINE!!!11one!!" crap because it was an innovative sequel.