Author Topic: Super Mario Galaxy 2 (Read 131340 times)

Glitchy · « **Reply #90 on:** December 23, 2009, 07:43:59 PM »

Quote from: Tv_Themes on December 23, 2009, 11:25:32 AM

I think I'm the only one in the entire fanbase who thought SMS was a Masterpiece (despite the presence of Mini-Me Bowser).

Me too, it's an amazing game.

Tv_Themes · « **Reply #91 on:** December 23, 2009, 08:32:25 PM »

Yes, but they don't NEED to.

ShadowBrain · « **Reply #92 on:** December 23, 2009, 09:51:43 PM »

This is a rare case where the logic behind an argument is patently flawed but any rebuttal would be even more confusing.

Tv_Themes · « **Reply #93 on:** December 23, 2009, 10:49:04 PM »

I think concerning SMS, its because I grew up on an island.

Trainman · « **Reply #94 on:** December 24, 2009, 05:56:42 AM »

Quote from: Tv_Themes on December 23, 2009, 11:25:32 AM

I think I'm the only one in the entire fanbase who thought SMS was a Masterpiece (despite the presence of Mini-Me Bowser).

I've always thought SMS was a masterpiece. Nintendo actually put its foot down and gave voice acting and very nice cinematics a try and it was such a great attempt. It actually painted the story very well and really immersed you. It gave you a reason why everything was happening and what you had to do rather than just, "well, the princess is gone again. here's your adventure. go do it." Hell, Mario even said complete sentences in the Japanese version, and even before I knew that, Mario & crew was speaking more in intros and certain spots in spin-off sports titles. I was hoping that Mario Galaxy would take that to the next level, but sadly, it did an about-face and dumbed it back down. The intro to Galaxy was great and reminded me of Sunshine's, but past that, they all fell short again (except for the last sequence.... but it still didn't have any full voice acting which was a shame). When characters make random grunts, laughs, or miscellaneous sounds, that is not speaking. I hate hearing a character make a sound, but then seeing that that sound = a couple complete sentences in the text box.

Galaxy 2 seems to be following NSMB Wii's route in that it will be dumbed down to zero story and will be, "Well, Bowser's at it again. Go take care of it." Hell, even the story in Super Mario Bros.' manual seems like it's more intricate that Galaxy 2's story will be. For all the people that say any type of story element should be confined to Mario RPGs: No, just no. I don't really even consider the RPGs to have that much of a story since any long-winded explanations and tales told in the game always have to do with the unrelated madmen & random heroes from the great beyond (that will never be seen or mentioned again) and their back-stories at hand: Smithy, Shadow Queen, Count Bleck, Mallow, Geno, etc. etc.

I guess Galaxy had less of a cinematic feel (and story) and Galaxy 2 will have even less of a cinematic feel (and story) because...

ALL WE WANT IZ GAEMPLAY AMIRITE

Turtlekid1 · « **Reply #95 on:** December 24, 2009, 07:05:02 AM »

To be fair, though, Galaxy had a nice bit of back story in the form of Rosalina's book. Quite honestly, I don't really mind whether there's voice acting or not, because Mario is traditionally a ~~silent~~ quiet protagonist; and the current voice they have for Peach is just fine for small things like "Help!" or "Thank you!" but I think it would really get on my nerves if it were heard more than that..

Trainman · « **Reply #96 on:** December 24, 2009, 12:46:47 PM »

Well, a complete sentence here and there would be nice. "Come back here!" and "Hey! Stop!" does not count.

Like I've said before, I think Mario should have a more active speaking role during gameplay rather than his usual yells and grunts. You know the man's got more things running through his mind than "Yah! Hoo-hoo! Wee-hee!" He should maybe comment on his surroundings and/or certain situations so he is more in tune with the environment and things happening in the environment rather than just being an automaton.

ToadBowser · « **Reply #97 on:** December 25, 2009, 12:51:37 AM »

I have two arguements to Mario talking.

First, the more a character talks, the less you feel like you are him, and the more you feel like you are controlling him.

Second, it would be kind of weird if Mario constantly chatted to himself about the things going on around him. Talking to yourslef is not ok.

ShadowBrain · « **Reply #98 on:** December 25, 2009, 06:44:07 AM »

I would be content with M&L-level gobbledygook in the main series. I mean, yes, I don't think he needs to carry on a conversation, but it makes more sense than gestures and the other person acting like he said something. This applies to the Zelda series as well, though I'm not sure I would want to hear Link gobbledygook...

Weegee · « **Reply #99 on:** December 25, 2009, 05:00:57 PM »

Quote from: ShadowBrain on December 25, 2009, 06:44:07 AM

though I'm not sure I would want to hear Link gobbledygook...

"Oh boy! I'm so hungry, I could eat an Octorok!

Anyways, silent protagonists have been a staple in countless preeminent game series for a reason. From Mario to Link to Gordon Freeman to Sonic in better times, non-conversational heroes have graced their respective games with opportunities for more accessible and immersive gameplay. Having such well-established characters speak (discounting grunts, noises or inane phrases) extrudes them further into a rigid, serious mold and detracts from their timelessness.

Trainman · « **Reply #100 on:** December 25, 2009, 06:52:26 PM »

Quote from: ToadBowser on December 25, 2009, 12:51:37 AM

I have two arguements to Mario talking.

First, the more a character talks, the less you feel like you are him, and the more you feel like you are controlling him.

Second, it would be kind of weird if Mario constantly chatted to himself about the things going on around him. Talking to yourslef is not ok.

To your first point: Not really. If anything, it makes me feel more immersed because it's like I'm in a natural setting. Take a look at Uncharted 2 for an example of the main character commenting as the level progresses. What he says is probably just about what's on your mind when the crap starts hitting the fan.

To your second point: Mario does talk to himself quite a bit (and in Italian jibberish) anyway in quite a few games. Apparently, he must do it so much that he talks in his sleep.

To all of you: I never said that Mario needed to comment on every blade of grass and every tree in the environment... nor did I say he needs to be involved in a Mario RPG length discussion: I say he needs to comment on action moments or strange moments where he would have a reaction to something. A "mamma mia!", "Hello!", "Whoa!" or a "Hmm..." for example. For more of an example:

"Mamma Mia" could be said when something jumps out of the bushes or if he is caught off-guard.
"Hello" could be said when seeing a friendly person in the level for the first time and maybe saying a different greeting after the first one (and a certain amount of time and/or distance has passed)
"Whoa" could be used when something large appear or something crazy happens.
"Hmm..." could be used for encountering a puzzle element.

And so on...

About the Tradition:

I dunno why you guys keep telling me that "wel, u do noe that its a japaneze ting 4 teh protagaaanist not to talkz, rite?" I know it's like some "sacred" tradition and if they break it the universe implodes. Oh wait, that should've happened in 2002 because Japan had Mario talk in the Japanese version of Super Mario Sunshine. So much for your "always silent" tradition; Japan themselves broke it. I say two complete sentences is enough to "break" the tradition, since you guys keep saying that Japanese honor and their games will be desecrated and ruined forever if the protagonist says any sentences at all.

Toad · « **Reply #101 on:** December 25, 2009, 10:11:53 PM »

Quote from: Trainman on December 25, 2009, 06:52:26 PM

"Hmm..." could be used for encountering a puzzle element.

"Hmm..." was used to great effect in Super Mario Sunshine. Hotel Delfino, any of the Shines that take place inside the hotel. Try to open a locked hotel room door..

Turtlekid1 · « **Reply #102 on:** December 26, 2009, 07:18:01 AM »

Quote from: Weegee on December 25, 2009, 05:00:57 PM

Anyways, silent protagonists have been a staple in countless preeminent game series for a reason. From Mario to Link to Gordon Freeman to Sonic in better times, non-conversational heroes have graced their respective games with opportunities for more accessible and immersive gameplay. Having such well-established characters speak (discounting grunts, noises or inane phrases) extrudes them further into a rigid, serious mold and detracts from their timelessness.

You make an interesting point, and in some/most cases I agree. For characters whose personalities have already been fairly well-established, such as Mario, full voice acting seems a tad unnecessary. However, Link, who's never really been given character traits other than vague heroism, has never struck me as a strong or interesting protagonist (except "Toon" Link from WW; I think it has to do with the cartoony depiction and more expressive face). Samus Aran was once a silent protagonist, but got a small monologue at the beginning of Super Metroid, and more monologues plus a scene of dialogue in Fusion. I think it's improved the character in this case. I suppose silence as a character trait works better for some characters than others (not that I want to see the return of CD-i Link, either).

Sqrt2 · « **Reply #103 on:** December 26, 2009, 06:45:07 PM »

I actually hate it when Mario talks. For example in the SMB Advance games, it sounds extremely grating to me when Mario says "Just what I needed!" every single time he gets a power-up. If they do give him voice acting, I'd like it to be as much as there is in SM64 (ie hardly any).

ShadowBrain · « **Reply #104 on:** December 26, 2009, 07:18:25 PM »

Well, a line does need to be drawn between important conversation and Mario unnecessarily and loudly talking to himself.